boost figures

Post 322572 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 16:22:33

Can someone tell me the ingear boost figures for a hlm 304 ? i'm starting to get very piszed off with the car now, with or without the remap, with a mbc or not it hits 10psi in 2nd and 3rd gear, with the traction off it wont even spin the wheels in first !!! ive changed every single hose on the car and bought proper clamps for the rip kit, ive adjusted the actuator so it is halfway over the hole, only thing left i can think of is a weak bcs but i still got the same readings with a mbc, talk about pulling your hair out !!!! next things going to be a can of petrol and a match......

Post 322574 by T5frankie on 2010-07-23 16:30:43

my car is standard and boosts at 10 psi in 2nd 3rd and 4th sometimes it overboosts and hits 12 psi but it dont like it and starts jerking, maybe its your gusge can you feel the difference with re-map or mbc?

Post 322575 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 16:35:01

to be honest mate it feels standard ! the pick ups no different, the mbc certainly felt quicker by a long way i know hamish said that its a simple plug in job but will it still need the battery disconecting to rest the bcs ?

Post 322576 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 16:36:27

[quote=brett craig;322572]Can someone tell me the ingear boost figures for a hlm 304 ? i'm starting to get very piszed off with the car now, with or without the remap, with a mbc or not it hits 10psi in 2nd and 3rd gear, with the traction off it wont even spin the wheels in first !!! ive changed every single hose on the car and bought proper clamps for the rip kit, ive adjusted the actuator so it is halfway over the hole, only thing left i can think of is a weak bcs but i still got the same readings with a mbc, talk about pulling your hair out !!!! next things going to be a can of petrol and a match......[/quote] You should start but setting the actuator with a pressure guage about 4psi with your 16t, its not something just to be set by eye mate, when you know thats right you can look at other things but it does sound like you have a leak somewhere and they can be very hard to find, i spent days looking for a leak in mine and in the end went to hamish to borrow his smoke machine and found it was leaking from the throttle body, hose and clamp looked perfect to me...would never of found it otherwise.

Post 322579 by T5frankie on 2010-07-23 16:38:22

[quote=brett craig;322575]to be honest mate it feels standard ! the pick ups no different, the mbc certainly felt quicker by a long way i know hamish said that its a simple plug in job but will it still need the battery disconecting to rest the bcs ?[/quote] im sure is supposed to boost at 16 psi on a hlm????

Post 322580 by T5frankie on 2010-07-23 16:38:52

[quote=leighkaicraigmia;322579]im sure is supposed to boost at 16 psi on a hlm????[/quote] mine is booked in in 2 weeks cant wait lol

Post 322581 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 16:41:21

the only access i have to a smoke machine is 20 sterling red fags lol, i'm tempted to put the whole car back to standard to see if that cures the problem, the actuator was very weak though, almost as loose as my mrs, so it was only tightend 1.5 turns, its holding to the redline from 2k no problems but the boost has not changed regardless of what i have changed,

Post 322582 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 16:42:20

[quote=leighkaicraigmia;322579]im sure is supposed to boost at 16 psi on a hlm????[/quote] hamish said to go for a run in 4th and it should hold around 18psi, but its 10psi in any gear atm

Post 322584 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 16:45:42

Give the actuator another turn then mate and see what happens but do it carefully, you could get one of those spray bottles with some soapy water in and spray around all the joins and see if you get any bubbles anywhere when reving and backing off, not the best method i know but done it myself.

Post 322586 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 16:47:24

[quote=jamest5r;322584]Give the actuator another turn then mate and see what happens but do it carefully, you could get one of those spray bottles with some soapy water in and spray around all the joins and see if you get any bubbles anywhere when reving and backing off, not the best method i know but done it myself.[/quote] do you know what mate, i'm going to give the soapy method a try, saves me stripping the lot. cheers for that.

Post 322588 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 16:48:21

[quote=brett craig;322582]hamish said to go for a run in 4th and it should hold around 18psi, but its 10psi in any gear atm[/quote] Those maps will go to 1.2 bar in 4th then back off a little, start by taking the mbc off mate and go from there as i said above, defo sounds like a leak or actuator prob.

Post 322594 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 17:07:42

well been outside for 10mins with soapy water and found the following.............. 2 small leaks on the crossover pipe from turbo to top intercooler, 1 quite large leak from bottom intercooler to idle control valve, 1 small leak on bottom intercooler hose. mbc was removed before remap mate so just silicone hoses now, could that list loose me 8psi that easy ?

Post 322596 by JelT5 on 2010-07-23 17:10:32

[quote=brett craig;322594]well been outside for 10mins with soapy water and found the following.............. 2 small leaks on the crossover pipe from turbo to top intercooler, 1 quite large leak from bottom intercooler to idle control valve, 1 small leak on bottom intercooler hose. mbc was removed before remap mate so just silicone hoses now, could that list loose me 8psi that easy ?[/quote] Definitely! Hopefully you'll enjoy the remap now :)

Post 322598 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 17:23:32

[quote=JelT5;322596]Definitely! Hopefully you'll enjoy the remap now :)[/quote] well ive sealed all the leaks except for the idle control valve, no bloody clamps left !! hopefuly this will now be sorted, if not then actuator is next on the list followed by bcs

Post 322599 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 17:50:44

all leaks now found and sealed, just taken the car up the road again, 1st,2nd,3rd,4th all foot to the floor and guess what ???? 10psi !!!! car certainly more responsive now but enoughs enough.

Post 322600 by t5_monkey on 2010-07-23 18:01:25

[quote=brett craig;322599]all leaks now found and sealed, just taken the car up the road again, 1st,2nd,3rd,4th all foot to the floor and guess what ???? 10psi !!!! car certainly more responsive now but enoughs enough.[/quote] sounds like its just running 10psi stock map somehow?

Post 322601 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 18:02:41

Your making good progress now mate, just adjust the actuator and you should be there, just go half a turn at a time.

Post 322602 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 18:07:00

[quote=t5_monkey;322600]sounds like its just running 10psi stock map somehow?[/quote] its certainly not stock as when the boost comes in 4th gear it picks up very well, just to 10 psi ! as for the actuator james will adjusting the actuator not put to much power into the engine to early ? or will it still build gradual ?

Post 322604 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 18:15:51

Just do it half a turn at a time and you will be safe, max boost will be 1.2 bar in 4th when you get it right, it still build gradual but take your time and be sensible build the power to wot gently you will be fine mate, you will only cause damage if you are silly and make 3 or 4 turns in one go and floor it.

Post 322610 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 18:48:37

well ive gone up 1.5 turns upto now and the car feels a little quicker but according to the gauge ive actualy dropped pressure ! can tightening have the opposite effect ? ive even moved the gauge to make sure its not pinching

Post 322618 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 19:06:06

Whats the guage on your dash reading?

Post 322619 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 19:15:05

dont have a dash gauge mate its a s70, just tried the opposite now and unwound by 2 full turns, picks up slower but holds on longer but still 10psi !

Post 322622 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 19:19:10

do you have to open the ecu to remap these ? its a early s70 pre me7 also is it worth unplugging the battery ?

Post 322627 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 19:35:59

Now im confused..go back to the tighting method and see what happens Yes they open the ecu and solder a new chip in.

Post 322629 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 19:43:35

mmmmmmmmmm i wonder if this ecu has been missed, all the tags are in place and undamaged

Post 322635 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 20:03:37

I would find that hard to belive as Hamish takes them to someone to solder the chips one at a time but it could be possible anything can happen in a busy garage, take your car to a garage and get them to pressure test your actuator and then set it at 4psi, now you have all the leaks sorted you will know for deffo whats going on.

Post 322638 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 20:05:38

well ive given up for today, i'm leaving the battery off for tonight in hope ! the actuator will be set up properly tomorrow and if that fails then the for sale section will be very busy. no money left for anymore parts and one very dissapointed owner

Post 322645 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-23 20:25:33

Dont worry mate it can be sorted.

Post 322646 by JelT5 on 2010-07-23 20:26:11

[quote=brett craig;322638]well ive given up for today, i'm leaving the battery off for tonight in hope ! the actuator will be set up properly tomorrow and if that fails then the for sale section will be very busy. no money left for anymore parts and one very dissapointed owner[/quote] I hope you get it sorted easily and quickly mate- you have my sympathy. I'm in the same position as you- bought a bigger turbo etc etc and ended up with just about the same output as a remap! Now having to save up the pennies to get it all running properly- bloody cars!! *sighs*

Post 322647 by mightywolf on 2010-07-23 20:26:26

just out of interest, when you had the mbc on did you ever get it above 10 psi?

Post 322648 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 20:31:38

to be honest mate when i first fitted it i got 4psi, after a couple of fiddles i got it up to 10psi, it felt quick but safe until i got my remap so never tried more, but i begin to wonder if i could have even got more !!

Post 322649 by mightywolf on 2010-07-23 20:34:56

well i've got it on mine now and its running at 14psi with the occasional spike to 15/16psi. do you know anyone close to you that has one that you could try again? if it would boost over 10psi with an mbc on surely its more likely to be an ecu problem and its running stock. mine's an S70R and it was running 10psi stock.

Post 322652 by brett craig on 2010-07-23 20:43:30

tomorrow i'll set the actuator up properly and go through every little detail, even down to plugs,leads and dizzy. i do wonder if the ecu was overlooked as the tags are untouched but i'll go down that road after exhausting all the above. do wonder now though if the mbc would have even gone above 10psi if i had tried, nice bit of kit though that mbc was, glad its working well for you.

Post 322724 by brett craig on 2010-07-24 10:59:26

Update !! i may have sorted the boost issues, found another leak on the boost gauge itself, ive also set the actuator at 4psi. went out for a spin and it sempt quicker until BANG and it blew the turbo to intercooler hose off, the only thing i can see is that the pressure must have been building higher to get it to blow off ! i'm also sure it popped over 10psi, what is the boost level for 2nd gear ? is it higher than 10 and upto 18 in 3rd 4th etc ?

Post 322726 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-24 11:02:54

Hi mate, should go to about 14psi in first then a little more in second then in 3/4th you should get about 1.2 bar, sounds like you are getting good pressure now just make sure all the clips are tight lol

Post 322779 by brett craig on 2010-07-24 16:47:00

i do know the exact problem now mate, theres 2 t-pipes on the boost gauge, and each one is leaking slightly at exactly 10psi

Post 322791 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-24 17:32:10

Glad to hear it, so hows the car driving??

Post 322792 by brett craig on 2010-07-24 17:37:57

[quote=jamest5r;322791]Glad to hear it, so hows the car driving??[/quote] its not at the minute lol, waiting now for intercooler clamps and some proper hose joints, so at the minute it feels standard due to not passing 10psi, it better bloody fly when ive replaced all these bits !

Post 322794 by dominic street on 2010-07-24 17:56:16

hope you dont mind me asking this question when my 2002 p2 v70 t5 idles what should the boost gauge read because my goes down as low as -0.8 thanks..dom

Post 322796 by brett craig on 2010-07-24 18:06:36

[quote=dominic street;322794]hope you dont mind me asking this question when my 2002 p2 v70 t5 idles what should the boost gauge read because my goes down as low as -0.8 thanks..dom[/quote] mine sits at a average of -24 on tickover but thats on a psi gauge mate

Post 322809 by mightywolf on 2010-07-24 18:59:36

[quote=brett craig;322792]its not at the minute lol, waiting now for intercooler clamps and some proper hose joints, so at the minute it feels standard due to not passing 10psi, it better bloody fly when ive replaced all these bits ![/quote] I'm sure it will mate, well done for getting to the bottom of it!

Post 322984 by Ed. on 2010-07-26 13:52:48

Apologies if i have got the wrong end of the stick, but if you took the car into HLM for remapping in the morning and then later on the same day you are posting that boost figures aren't right and car isn't boosting properly, surely HLM would be the place to contact if they supplied and fitted the map? I would have thought taking the car to any garage for remapping would have prompted the garage to at least check to see if the car was in a fit state of tune before mapping? Your reports of boost leaks that you found in your pipes and the mention of ecu looking like it has been unfettled suggests to me that none of these checks were made. It also sounds like the car was never tested by the garage after the mapping either, otherwise the lack of performance would have surely been apparent?

Post 323001 by brett craig on 2010-07-26 16:44:42

[quote=Ed.;322984]Apologies if i have got the wrong end of the stick, but if you took the car into HLM for remapping in the morning and then later on the same day you are posting that boost figures aren't right and car isn't boosting properly, surely HLM would be the place to contact if they supplied and fitted the map? I would have thought taking the car to any garage for remapping would have prompted the garage to at least check to see if the car was in a fit state of tune before mapping? Your reports of boost leaks that you found in your pipes and the mention of ecu looking like it has been unfettled suggests to me that none of these checks were made. It also sounds like the car was never tested by the garage after the mapping either, otherwise the lack of performance would have surely been apparent?[/quote] sorry but i didnt quite give all the facts and figures due to not wanting to post a long boring question, the car never went to hlm, i just took the ecu due to the fact the T5 was in a hundred pieces, when the car was running lower boost figures the leaks were not so obvious. now that it can go above the standard 10psi it found all the weakspots, ive now sorted all the leaks and the car is certainly quicker but due to blowing hoses off i still cannot get full power, this will be sorted once the new clamps arrive. i did not contact hlm straight away as i wanted to cure all known faults before concluding the ecu was at fault, the actuator was set incorrect, plenty of hose leaks and various other faults. once all faults have been sorted i can pass judgement on the ecu map. hope thats a little clearer mate.

Post 323170 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 18:43:19

Well the clamps arrived today, ive fitted these and sealed every leak on the car and............. max 11psi in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th. i have now run out of ideas, the system is sealed, the actuator is set at 4psi and all hoses are new, has anyone got anymore ideas before i ring hlm tomorrow ? its almost as if the map is standard, but dont want to go down that road before ive made sure its not my cock up.

Post 323177 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-27 19:06:11

Hows the car actually driving mate?, forget about the figures for a min.

Post 323180 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 19:13:18

car drives fine, no roughness, smooth to the redline, kicks in around the 3k mark, no smoke,noises or overheating. may have a slight exhaust leak after the thrash i gave it tonight but nothing out the ordinary.

Post 323186 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-27 19:23:08

All i can suggest is the you put it on the r/r mate, only way to know for sure. Not a lot of help i know, sorry but im out of ideas now.

Post 323187 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 19:25:28

well i'm going back to basics with it now, after my holiday the rip kit is coming off, the recirc valves going back on, airbox and replace bcs. see where that takes me

Post 323189 by Jamest5r on 2010-07-27 19:28:55

Ive got a spare recirc and bcs lying around somewhere if you want to try, im only a short hop down the a38 from you i think.

Post 323190 by claymore on 2010-07-27 19:29:55

Mine wouldn't boost past 10psi either, even with the actuator set right, i assume it was just a knackerd actuator, so i just kept winding it in a turn every couple of days, by the time I'd finished I was up to 17psi, with no problems.

Post 323192 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 19:31:59

thanks very much for the offer mate but ive already got both items enroute lol, my recircs still in my garage, my options left as far as i can see it are. weak actuator faulty bcs leak in the rip somewhere cone filter not flowing enough air leak around the recirc blank plate

Post 323193 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 19:33:58

[quote=claymore;323190]Mine wouldn't boost past 10psi either, even with the actuator set right, i assume it was just a knackerd actuator, so i just kept winding it in a turn every couple of days, by the time I'd finished I was up to 17psi, with no problems.[/quote] this was a option i looked at but didnt want to overload the engine, would the map still control the amount the actuator opened, thus not putting to much torque in to early ?

Post 323194 by claymore on 2010-07-27 19:55:17

I use an mbc with mine aswell.

Post 323199 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 20:06:01

in that case the map should be fine with a few actuator adjustments then

Post 323216 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 21:25:20

well ive put 1 full turn on the actuator tonight, i shall see what effect it has on the way to work tomorrow. out of interest what increase should 1 full turn give ? so i can gauge if i am going in the right direction

Post 323224 by Nathlm on 2010-07-27 21:41:32

Brett It could be a number of issues.....what fuel are you using, there could be problems with your maff, bcs - really a number of things. If you can spare the time its best to bring it over to us. A full smoke test is a must and a dyno would also help. Ring me or Hamish tomorrow, he will be working tomorrow afternoon as Marcus is learning to sail in the morning. Nat

Post 323227 by claymore on 2010-07-27 21:42:33

I think I used about 4 full turns to get my boost up, I ran the car like that for a couple of months, then replaced the actuator with a good one, but it should tell you if that's where your problem is.

Post 323232 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 21:56:41

[quote=Nathlm;323224]Brett It could be a number of issues.....what fuel are you using, there could be problems with your maff, bcs - really a number of things. If you can spare the time its best to bring it over to us. A full smoke test is a must and a dyno would also help. Ring me or Hamish tomorrow, he will be working tomorrow afternoon as Marcus is learning to sail in the morning. Nat[/quote] thanks for the reply nat, i only run v-power. ive got a spare bcs, and i'll try the standard pipework before i pop it over. Grateful of the offer but i'll make sure ive covered all my possible cockups before i do lol. i'm on holiday from friday so if i have no luck then i'll ring and pop over when i get back. cheers again

Post 323235 by brett craig on 2010-07-27 21:58:43

[quote=claymore;323227]I think I used about 4 full turns to get my boost up, I ran the car like that for a couple of months, then replaced the actuator with a good one, but it should tell you if that's where your problem is.[/quote] i would assume that 1 turn would take me to 12-13psi then gauging from your result.

Post 323359 by smithy on 2010-07-28 14:16:59

the rip kit should not effect your boost mate if i was you get a smoke test done if you think its your bcs then try a mbc and if its your actuator it will not boost anymore with the mbc or bcs.best thing to do is take it to hlm and get full checkup and if it is the map hamish can sort that on site for you mate

Post 323404 by brett craig on 2010-07-28 20:09:50

cheers for the advice smithy, its not the rip i'm worried about. i had to cobble some silicone pipe together for the idle control valve, i cant see a leak but to be sure i'll put the standard kit on and rule it out. then i'll pull the pipework for the boost gauge to make sure theres no kinks or traps. i'm sure when i had the mbc fitted it only hit 10psi aswell. i put 1 turn on it last night and it feels quicker but only 11psi, i'm going to put 1 more turn on it tomorrow and if it still onky gets to 10/11psi i'll leave it at that as i'm not going to destroy the engine. if in standard trim with just the ecu i get the same results then i'll pop over to hlm, sort of a process of elimination without the expenditure if you know what i mean ?

Post 323587 by brett craig on 2010-07-30 16:59:36

well the plot thickens !!! replace the recirc plate and 2 other leaking hoses and now have the following. 1st gear 5psi 2nd gear 9psi 3rd gear 13 psi figure that one out ? lower than standard boost in 1st but higher than standard in 3rd onwards

Post 323609 by mightywolf on 2010-07-30 18:57:15

are you sure theres not a problem with the boost gauge?

Post 323613 by brett craig on 2010-07-30 19:08:33

lets just say it wont even spin in 1st so it cant be far out, its realy not quick at all

Post 323848 by wallace570 on 2010-08-01 21:17:43

try a new boost solenoid will cost about £50 i think or if u have a friend thats got the same year of t5 try theres out

Post 324838 by brett craig on 2010-08-08 17:09:18

well i'm nearly 100% sure now that its the ecu, by my logical thinking i figure that if the bcs,maf,actuator were faulty and not allowing it to boost pass 10psi then i should still get 10psi in every gear and no less. as it is mapped for 15psi in 1st and more after this. i spent the whole of today with the car in bits and triple checked/tightened every clamp,hose,joint. cleaned the maf, and checked dizzy arm and cap again, and all is perfect, every boost hose is new and it drives totaly smooth and revs clean, its never actualy run aswell as this but the figures of 6psi in 1st, 8-9psi in 2nd and 10psi in every other gear is exactly what the standard figures should be. i cant get over with the car to hlm due to work so ive emailed nat and hope to post it back to be checked whilst on my next holiday, fingers crossed its just a ecu thats been overlooked or just marked up wrong, if not then time to get my wallet out again.

Post 327947 by SAMXPJ on 2010-08-26 12:11:16

For what it's worth I got a different boost figure [2lb] when changing the maff for another used one. I would think that with more or less corrosion on the maff wires then the change in resistance seen by the ecu as the air is flowing over the wires is being interpreted as more or less air going into system and the fuel will be measured accordingly. I have often wondered if putting a resistor in series with the maff would fool the ecu and change the boost figure? Has anyone done any testing on these maff's?

Post 328045 by pjaystar on 2010-08-26 21:06:03

having the same problem with mine replaced maf plugs cap rotor leads coil no air leaks and will not boost over 10 psi with an mbc fitted it feels slugish and the boost drops mine also has an hlm chip let me know when you get it sorted mate

Post 329104 by brett craig on 2010-09-02 16:22:31

well fitted a mbc today and the boosts straight up and strong so i tihnk i can assume my bcs is shot !

Post 329145 by smithy on 2010-09-02 17:59:01

leave the mbc on it mate and set it to 1.1 to 1.2 bar and keep the boost pipes from the turbo to the mbc short to stop boost spikes .

Post 329151 by Jamest5r on 2010-09-02 18:34:08

[quote=brett craig;329104]well fitted a mbc today and the boosts straight up and strong so i tihnk i can assume my bcs is shot ![/quote] Thank fu*k for that mate, glad your getting somewhere.

Post 329177 by brett craig on 2010-09-02 21:15:06

would you f***ing believe it, out tonight and went to 16psi in 3rd, and the bloody clutch slipped !!!! it never rains but it pours, time to be gentle with it till jan when the mot is up and it'll be off the road having a new engine, suspension and brakes anyway.