Fitting an IPD boost guage and door pod (P2)

Post 493395 by LeeT5 on 2012-04-30 22:15:21

Right, I know MartinPeachey has done a thread but this is for a door pod and guage. I used an IPD 'R' guage seen here: http://www.ipdusa.com/products/6153/115539-ipd-r-styled-boost-gauge Also i used a Carbon fibre door pod from Carbonfiberwerks.... http://carbonfiberwerks.stimuluscreations.com/v70.htm You can have them prime the pod if you want to spray a different colour. I primed mine myself using Halfords surface cleaner, 2 coats of primer and 3 coats of top coat Matte black. OK, on with the mod. You'll need at least 3m of silicone vac hose as the polyurethane tubing they provide only gets you into the wing under the bonnet. First of all open the bonnet and remove the Air box or in my case AMS system: Next, remove the drivers door card following this easy to follow video: [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_UpoWWpP2U[/ame] Your door will look like this: Next, unbolt bonnet catch using a 10mm socket. Pull back carpet, remove footwell light lower shroud and gain access to rubber cable harness trunking on drivers kick panel: Undo door check strap - shown in this picture: This will gain you vital access later in the mod. Undo the two 10mm nuts and squeeze the black pegs at the top of the harness plug. this will come apart. Pull out the white plugged harness: using a 4mm drill bit and 2.5mm drill bit, drill into the empty sockets like so.... Undo the other harness that goes through the side of the car and drill out the opposite plug. This will enable you to feed the vac hose and 5amp wire for the light on the guage. make sure you only push the vac hose as far as the middle harness as you'll need to make a hole for it to protrude through. The 5amp wire will continue into the car. (To be continued)

Post 493454 by graemewelch on 2012-05-01 01:00:00

will be watching this with intrest. been thinking about doing this exact mod for a while. if you dont mind me asking whats the cost inc import tax. i was just going to order it a while ago but when it went yo basket it said couldnt take payment or sumit along those lines

Post 493458 by Wobbly Dave on 2012-05-01 01:21:17

why are you making this so difficult by mounting on the door?

Post 493462 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-01 02:36:39

[quote=Wobbly Dave;493458]why are you making this so difficult by mounting on the door?[/quote] I'm not making it difficult Dave. You'll see when i finished. i don't like the IPD pod (it looks crap) and i didn't want it just stuck on the dash like a bloody tom tom!

Post 493466 by graemewelch on 2012-05-01 04:11:27

my thoughts exactly. if modding a interior it has to look oe

Post 493467 by volvokid on 2012-05-01 04:37:58

Looking forward to see this finished

Post 494619 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-04 21:08:37

Ok ladies, i finished the install today so heres the rest of it: With air box removed, locate vac hose shown by my finger.... Then, using the supplied T piece, cut into hose and fit like so.... I used my own silicone hose to make up the bits i removed. With the vac hose plumbed through the rubber trunking, attach it to a metal rod and feed it up through the wing like so. I also used spare wire to pull it through. Be careful not to kink the polyurthane tubing.... Next, using the supplied brass fittings, attach the poly tubing to the silicone tubing. I ran the blue silicone tubing round the front of the scuttle to the o/s wing.... Next, Using fuse 20 in the side fuse box, remove the fuse box by pushing on the white tab at the top. Pull it towards you and gain access to the rear of fuse 20. Two blue wires (both ignition feed). Splice into one of these using a scitch lock and connect your live feed wire. Now, working from the door end. Twist the white and red wires of the guage together and solder. Then connect to a 5 amp female/female connector. Then connect the other end of your feed wire to the connector. Note: If you want your guage to be bright, do not connect the white wire, just the red. If you want it to be dimmed (like i do) connect both wires. The black wire is earth and i connected it to the black earth wire for the door locking control module earth in the door. Then connect your poly tubing to the guage, refit the door card after tidying up the wiring using cable ties. Refit fuse box and cover. Refit bonnet latch and carpet and floor lighting panel. I used black mastic (that sticky stuff that can be used again and again. It holds the pod perfect and is very strong. Makes it permenant but easily removed if it needs to be. Stand back and admire your handy work. :wink: Engine running on idle... Night time shot to follow...... Guage is reading -20 psi vac on deceleration and boosting at 15psi with a peak boost of 20 psi. I noted that the needle was fluctuating a little between 15 - 20 psi on WOT but i know this is because of a weak Recirculating valve. That's next on my list. The needle sits on 0 psi when switched off.

Post 494621 by claymore on 2012-05-04 21:17:21

That's a great write up, and that gauge looks realy oem, nice job.

Post 494622 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-04 21:19:35

Hope you enjoyed!! I am very very pleased with the results and wish i'd done it last year when i bought the gear.

Post 494628 by Jimmie on 2012-05-04 21:52:36

I like were you fitted the gauge as it looks as if it had always been there. The only concern i would have is causing damage to the internals over a period with the knock when shutting the door.

Post 494633 by Wobbly Dave on 2012-05-04 22:16:14

I take back wot I said. As installs go that really looks smart

Post 494642 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-04 22:36:58

[quote=Jimmie;494628]I like were you fitted the gauge as it looks as if it had always been there. The only concern i would have is causing damage to the internals over a period with the knock when shutting the door.[/quote] Run that by me again? What do you mean Jimmie?

Post 494644 by Jimmie on 2012-05-04 22:43:19

Lee as its fitted to the door will the internals e.g needle etc not get damaged when the door gets slammed as does happen.

Post 494650 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-04 23:12:33

[quote=Jimmie;494644]Lee as its fitted to the door will the internals e.g needle etc not get damaged when the door gets slammed as does happen.[/quote] No mate. Think about it...... Where the door pod is, in relation to a fulcrum. It's at the closest point to the fulcrum, therefore, less movement. Also, who said anything about slamming the door? I can close my door very gently as i have the door shims fitted and the alighnment is perfect. I only have to gently push or pull it and the door closes firmly with a solid 'Thunk'! Also, when the door is closed the pod doesn't actually touch the A pillar. It nestles up against the soft rubber A pillar strip. It's a perfect fit - i promise!

Post 494653 by graemewelch on 2012-05-04 23:21:16

good write up. its a mod i plan on doing soon.

Post 494666 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-05 05:53:51

[COLOR="DarkOrange"]I would just like to say a big thanks to my friend Bill who owns an R the same as mine. He has already done this mod and provided me with his photos to help me do mine.[/COLOR] :beer:

Post 494702 by 960kg on 2012-05-05 12:47:29

[quote=LeeT5;494619] Guage is reading -20 psi vac on deceleration and boosting at 15psi with a peak boost of 20 psi. I noted that the needle was fluctuating a little between 15 - 20 psi on WOT but i know this is because of a weak Recirculating valve. That's next on my list. The needle sits on 0 psi when switched off.[/quote] On deceleration you should read about -24psi vac and idle on -22psi vac depending on engine condition. The reason your readings are out is because of the long route of hose, you should really shorten it as much as you can so that as well as deceleration being accurate so will the boost be more accurate the reason for the fluctuation between boost figures is because you have used silicon hose instead of hard plastic 4mm clear hose which does not compress so therefore the boost will cause the hose to pulse , it won`t be your recirculating valve as these are good for 24psi and are reliable as long as the vacuum pipe to it is in good condition, even a stronger spring will not stop pulsing of the boost as the valve is closed shut because of the boost in the inlet manifold!! Believe me i have been there and wasted time!! Although the end result does look nice the gauge cannot be accurate because of the hose length to it from the engine vacuum tree. Boost has to be accurate otherwise Bang! It is the same as having the hoses from the wastegate to the compression side of the turbo the hoses have to be as short as possible for the ECU to quickly apply accurate boost control and not spike damaging boost. Only trying to help.

Post 494717 by volvokid on 2012-05-05 14:04:51

Looks really pretty, I have read on swedspeed about people complaining that the IPD gauge flutters under full load

Post 494806 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-05 18:18:33

[quote=960kg;494702]On deceleration you should read about -24psi vac and idle on -22psi vac depending on engine condition. The reason your readings are out is because of the long route of hose, you should really shorten it as much as you can so that as well as deceleration being accurate so will the boost be more accurate the reason for the fluctuation between boost figures is because you have used silicon hose instead of hard plastic 4mm clear hose which does not compress so therefore the boost will cause the hose to pulse , it won`t be your recirculating valve as these are good for 24psi and are reliable as long as the vacuum pipe to it is in good condition, even a stronger spring will not stop pulsing of the boost as the valve is closed shut because of the boost in the inlet manifold!! Believe me i have been there and wasted time!! Although the end result does look nice the gauge cannot be accurate because of the hose length to it from the engine vacuum tree. Boost has to be accurate otherwise Bang! It is the same as having the hoses from the wastegate to the compression side of the turbo the hoses have to be as short as possible for the ECU to quickly apply accurate boost control and not spike damaging boost. Only trying to help.[/quote] I have emailed IPD about the fluttering needle at high boost. I understand what your saying but i'm not convinced its the silicone vac hose. IPD supplied me with the hose when i ordered the guage. I asked for enough hose to do my install and that is what they provided. If the silicone hose expands under 20+ psi then surely its not fit for purpose?? Why, then, would they provide me with hose knowing its going to cause me problems. They use the same hose on their own installs. The needle is totally stable until 15 psi hense why i don't believe it's anything to to with 'expanding silicone hose causing needle fluttering from 15 - 20 psi'. In the mean time i'm going to install my oe MAP and see what happens to the guage then. Lots of interesting reading about needle flutter on boost and its mostly saying its not the guage. Some saying its the inlet valves opening causing inlet manifold pressure to oscillate. Another reason for me not suspecting it to be the silicone hose is because if it were able to expand and cause fluttering then you would never be able to use it for IC tubing. Anyone else experienced guage flutter??

Post 494809 by Harvey on 2012-05-05 18:23:48

Hi is the pipe kit for a L/H drive car not a R/H is that why it's to short ?. Sorry must say nice looking job,lots of info as well.

Post 494812 by Al115 on 2012-05-05 18:27:37

Nice! Really smart, Lee. I will do something similar soon, but with a SPA digital gauge. Like the look of the IPD one but don't trust it's readings.

Post 494814 by volvokid on 2012-05-05 18:31:27

I think Lee needs to stop all these threads because he always gets me dreaming about doing the same stuff!!!

Post 494817 by 960kg on 2012-05-05 18:40:50

[quote=LeeT5;494806]I have emailed IPD about the fluttering needle at high boost. I understand what your saying but i'm not convinced its the silicone vac hose. IPD supplied me with the hose when i ordered the guage. I asked for enough hose to do my install and that is what they provided. If the silicone hose expands under 20+ psi then surely its not fit for purpose?? Why, then, would they provide me with hose knowing its going to cause me problems. They use the same hose on their own installs. The needle is totally stable until 15 psi hense why i don't believe it's anything to to with 'expanding silicone hose causing needle fluttering from 15 - 20 psi'.[/quote] I am only trying to help and not hinder! Companies will supply whatever they have at the time! When i got my Boost/Vac Guage they supplied 4mm of clear plastic tubing which will not compress between the fingers but they only supply 1 metre which will only reach the engine side bulkhead so how can i read it? because they only supply what they supply! Think how far your pipe goes to get to the door mounted guage from the left side of the engine as you have gone around the front of the car ( you should re-route straight back to the bulkhead and through a grommet on the drivers side to keep it at it`s shortest) and then with the boost changing per milli-second and the soft silicon hose compressing then bulging and that is why it flutters...think about it as its` true as i had to go and buy some more clear pipe and redo my own. When i was doing a Stage 0 tune ready for my HLM304 map i put new blue silicon hose on the compressor side of the turbo to wastegate and even that short the boost was all over the place. I went and bought the pucker Volvo rubber hose and the needle is as steady as a rock right up to 18psi and on gearchange will go right back to -24 and back up to 18. "Volvokid" mentions the fluttering on there guages and i suppose using the same pod. Shorten it as much as you possibly can and use clear plastic hose and see the difference!

Post 494846 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-05 19:32:06

[quote=Harvey;494809]Hi is the pipe kit for a L/H drive car not a R/H is that why it's to short ?. Sorry must say nice looking job,lots of info as well.[/quote] Yes.

Post 494893 by Dream3r on 2012-05-05 21:09:09

Here's mine done last year my MRG

Post 494894 by Dream3r on 2012-05-05 21:10:23

Power came from the door wiring via a wiring diagram and soldering iron

Post 494912 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-05 21:59:44

[quote=960kg;494817]I am only trying to help and not hinder! Companies will supply whatever they have at the time! When i got my Boost/Vac Guage they supplied 4mm of clear plastic tubing which will not compress between the fingers but they only supply 1 metre which will only reach the engine side bulkhead so how can i read it? because they only supply what they supply! Think how far your pipe goes to get to the door mounted guage from the left side of the engine as you have gone around the front of the car ( you should re-route straight back to the bulkhead and through a grommet on the drivers side to keep it at it`s shortest) and then with the boost changing per milli-second and the soft silicon hose compressing then bulging and that is why it flutters...think about it as its` true as i had to go and buy some more clear pipe and redo my own. When i was doing a Stage 0 tune ready for my HLM304 map i put new blue silicon hose on the compressor side of the turbo to wastegate and even that short the boost was all over the place. I went and bought the pucker Volvo rubber hose and the needle is as steady as a rock right up to 18psi and on gearchange will go right back to -24 and back up to 18. "Volvokid" mentions the fluttering on there guages and i suppose using the same pod. Shorten it as much as you possibly can and use clear plastic hose and see the difference![/quote] Thanks, but i will reserve judgement until i have replaced my TBV. A friend of mine has the same car, same guage and had the same problem. He replaced his TBV and now the fluttering has gone. Coincidently, i checked mine again tonight. Readings are: -20 psi idle. - 24 psi deceleration in any gear. Peak boost at 20 psi WOT. Once i've replaced the TBV i will see what the guage does then. If it still flutters then i'll replace the silicone with Volvo oe turbo tubing.

Post 494984 by 960kg on 2012-05-06 09:55:19

Post 495099 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-06 18:19:17

I am not buying another oe one to go on. I have already bought a Forge piston type TBV. Just need half a day to fit cos there a bit of a pain in the ar se.

Post 495109 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-06 18:31:47

[quote=960kg;494984]I think you are getting your Valves mixed up the Recirculating valve won`t cause flutter on the guage as the boost is identical in the hose supplying it but the TBV can do if faulty but changing the flexible tubing is a cheaper first option than paying for the new TBV whichs is £51 including vat as i have a new one because my original had covered to many miles![/quote] Sorry mate but i think it is you that is confused. A CBV (Compressor Bypass Valve) and a Turbo Recirculating Valve are the same thing. It's just different terminology used by different manufacturers. Look: http://www.vivaperformance.com/cbv-upgrade-kit-s60r-v70r-s60-t5/ ...and... http://www.partsforvolvosonline.com/product_info.php?products_id=6602 The one i purchased was the Forge alloy CBV. Its now fitted with the yellow spring which is for mapped cars and i just need to fit the dam thing. Also a recirc' valve can cause the guage needle to flutter at high boost due to the diaphram leaking. The diaphram opens slightly and immediately shuts repeatedly open/close under high pressure. This opening and closing of the diaphram is diplayed as needle flutter on the guage. Some people also confuse this with compressor surge. That's a completely different phenomenom and only happens at low revs. This was the fault my mate had. Like i said, he replaced his oe recirc valve and fitted a piston type alloy CBV and the needle fluttered no more. Your help is appreciated. Unfortunately 960KG (err...don't know yer name) There is no easy place to go through the bulkhead on a P26. It's a bloody PITA. :)

Post 495120 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-06 18:47:43

[quote=volvokid;494814]I think Lee needs to stop all these threads because he always gets me dreaming about doing the same stuff!!![/quote] :hail: :D

Post 495122 by 960kg on 2012-05-06 18:48:28

[quote=LeeT5;495109]Sorry mate but i think it is you that is confused. A CBV (Compressor Bypass Valve) and a Turbo Recirculating Valve are the same thing. It's just different terminology used by different manufacturers. Look: http://www.vivaperformance.com/cbv-upgrade-kit-s60r-v70r-s60-t5/ ...and... http://www.partsforvolvosonline.com/product_info.php?products_id=6602 The one i purchased was the Forge alloy CBV. Its now fitted with the yellow spring which is for mapped cars and i just need to fit the dam thing. Also a recirc' valve can cause the guage needle to flutter at high boost due to the diaphram leaking. This was the fault my mate had. Like i said, he replaced his oe recirc valve and fitted a piston type alloy CBV and the needle fluttered no more.[/quote] Sorry, but i don`t understand mate as you have now mentioned the TBV as a CBV!!!! I call things by there Volvo name and not by a name made up by others .......i do know what i mean and what i am saying. But you have a Forge one so you need to try the blue spring don`t you??? You should have received three springs when you bought the kit. I believe the red spring may be 18 to 20 psi!

Post 495135 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-06 19:10:29

[quote=960kg;495122]Sorry, but i don`t understand mate as you have now mentioned the TBV as a CBV!!!! I call things by there Volvo name and not by a name made up by others .......i do know what i mean and what i am saying. But you have a Forge one so you need to try the blue spring don`t you??? You should have received three springs when you bought the kit. I believe the red spring may be 18 to 20 psi![/quote] LOL. In the world of engineering a Turbo is a compressor. The word 'Turbo' is a slang term used in the automotive industry and is derived from the word Turbine. A turbocharger, or turbo (colloquialism), from the Greek "τύρβη" (mixing/spinning) is a forced induction device used to allow more power to be produced for an engine of a given size. It is formally known as a turbosupercharger, as it is a type of supercharger whose power is driven from an exhaust gas turbine. The key difference between a turbocharger and a conventional supercharger is that the latter is mechanically driven from the engine often from a belt connected to the crankshaft. The benefit of a turbo is that it compresses a greater mass of intake air into the combustion chamber(s), thereby resulting in increased power and/or efficiency. Basically, at the end of the day, TBV (turbo bypass valve) or CBV (compressor bypass valve) mean the same thing. A recirculating valve is also the same thing because it recirculates the wasted pressure back into the induction side without exhausting it to atmosphere which is precisely what Dump valves do! A Recirc valve/TBV/CBV will ALWAYS be better than a Dump valve (those stupid things that make the PHHSSSSSTTTT!!!! noise because when the excess pressure is vented to atmosphere there is less pressure in the intercooler and associated hoses. Therefore, the turbo, thou still spooling at around 80,000rpm will have to play catch up to get max boost again. Unlike the TBV/CBV or recirc valve (whatever you wanna call it) the excess pressure is vented into the induction piping and therefore intercooler pressures are maintained so the turbo does not have to spool up as much to reach max boost. I can't explain it any easier than that but if you read up on how Compressors (or Turbo chargers) work then all will become clearerererer!!!:wink:

Post 495138 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-06 19:13:20

[quote=960kg;495122] But you have a Forge one so you need to try the blue spring don`t you??? You should have received three springs when you bought the kit. I believe the red spring may be 18 to 20 psi![/quote] if you buy a Forge CBV for a late T5/V70R/S60R... Forge Recirculation Valve For Volvo Part Number FMDVK04S It only comes with 2 springs. Green and Yellow. Green is stock pressure and yellow is good for up to 25psi.

Post 495483 by 960kg on 2012-05-07 16:58:18

[quote=LeeT5;495135]LOL. In the world of engineering a Turbo is a compressor. The word 'Turbo' is a slang term used in the automotive industry and is derived from the word Turbine. A turbocharger, or turbo (colloquialism), from the Greek "τύρβη" (mixing/spinning) is a forced induction device used to allow more power to be produced for an engine of a given size. It is formally known as a turbosupercharger, as it is a type of supercharger whose power is driven from an exhaust gas turbine. The key difference between a turbocharger and a conventional supercharger is that the latter is mechanically driven from the engine often from a belt connected to the crankshaft. The benefit of a turbo is that it compresses a greater mass of intake air into the combustion chamber(s), thereby resulting in increased power and/or efficiency. Basically, at the end of the day, TBV (turbo bypass valve) or CBV (compressor bypass valve) mean the same thing. A recirculating valve is also the same thing because it recirculates the wasted pressure back into the induction side without exhausting it to atmosphere which is precisely what Dump valves do! A Recirc valve/TBV/CBV will ALWAYS be better than a Dump valve (those stupid things that make the PHHSSSSSTTTT!!!! noise because when the excess pressure is vented to atmosphere there is less pressure in the intercooler and associated hoses. Therefore, the turbo, thou still spooling at around 80,000rpm will have to play catch up to get max boost again. Unlike the TBV/CBV or recirc valve (whatever you wanna call it) the excess pressure is vented into the induction piping and therefore intercooler pressures are maintained so the turbo does not have to spool up as much to reach max boost. I can't explain it any easier than that but if you read up on how Compressors (or Turbo chargers) work then all will become clearerererer!!!:wink:[/quote] ahhhhh!.....you were just being clever with abbreviations then!! I think i have trodden on rather a big nerve! [quote=LeeT5;495138]if you buy a Forge CBV for a late T5/V70R/S60R... Forge Recirculation Valve For Volvo Part Number FMDVK04S It only comes with 2 springs. Green and Yellow. Green is stock pressure and yellow is good for up to 25psi.[/quote] Did you know the psi figures given are spring rates and NOT boost rates?

Post 495888 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-08 12:01:39

[quote=960kg;495483] Did you know the psi figures given are spring rates and NOT boost rates?[/quote] Yes mate. I have already exhaustively researched this subject and the forge CBV. Lots of people have fitted in the states and a friend of mine has one on his R. All have major success and no running problems.

Post 497317 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-11 18:23:37

Update... After fitting my boost guage and the discussion turned to the Recirc valve, i can confirm after spending the best part of 5 hours today doing the crappy job, i have replaced my recirculating valve and fitted the yellow spring. I can tell you that the green spring that is fitted is rated to 10psi. Yellow is 10 - 16psi. Blue is 16 - 22psi. Red is 22psi and above. I fitted yellow because i did not want any compressor stall or surge. So far the result seem promising thou i am yet to properly open the car up. I will keep this thread updated....

Post 497320 by stribo on 2012-05-11 18:27:51

What is peak boost for an R?

Post 497321 by stribo on 2012-05-11 18:28:22

[quote=Dream3r;494893]Here's mine done last year my MRG [/quote] That looks great, what boost guage is it?

Post 497394 by LeeT5 on 2012-05-11 21:43:14

[quote=stribo;497320]What is peak boost for an R?[/quote] Wastegate should be set to 4.5 psi. I do not know what standard boost is or should be for an R with a kkk24 turbo but i would guess about 10psi. Remapped i would expect to see around 15-17psi. I haven't had the chance to open mine up yet as i've not had the chance to reset the ECU. I will do that tomorrow as the Boost pressure sensor and TCV will need to learn the new boost pressures utilising the mechanical piston type recirculating valve.