my 940 aka 'the barge'
Posts
Post 637497 by V70 Graham on 2013-08-21 20:18:53
Good work, that engine bay looks a lot better now, must run better too. Will be watching this with interest.
Post 637502 by iancho on 2013-08-21 20:32:18
Nice work mate keep it up :smile:
Post 637537 by smithy on 2013-08-21 21:12:21
Very nice mate looking with interest .i have an s40 1.8vvt x reg so I'm not jealous of your turbo promise lol
Post 637553 by AndysR on 2013-08-21 22:04:06
Looks smart, got a 940 LPT auto estate myself and absolutely love it :)
I'll be watching your progress with interest :)
Post 638584 by smithy on 2013-08-26 15:36:43
From what I have heard you can fit me7 blues with the resistor mod at 4bar on 3in maf will fuel no probs.and you will get less fuel cut too .but I might be wrong so someone else might correct me .
Post 638640 by artfulflounder on 2013-08-26 19:41:49
[QUOTE=smithy;638584]From what I have heard you can fit me7 blues with the resistor mod at 4bar on 3in maf will fuel no probs..[/QUOTE]
You are correct in what you say it is a straight swap but i'm far from that point at the moment and still got intercooler to upgrade before that..:parhmph: was going to rebuild a 15g with 19t compressor/housing but thats another story.lol
One good source of info i've found is 'Anthony Hyde' he is a lecturer at The Australian National University in the school of physics and engineering. He races a heavily modified volvo 240 turbo and covers many subjects from injectors,turbos,16v head swaps,gear boxes, 531/530 head comparison.......plus many more things.
Very interesting read and has proven results........have a look see.
http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~amh110/Technical_pages/hyde_quick_tech_index.htm
With regards to my post above found a few thermocouples that will cover temperature range i need for intercooler temps , could use a volt meter to read milivolts and a look up table to see temps....mmm still haven't found anything plug and play that is relatively cheap(scrooge).
As my hands on time is limited due to having young kids i do lots of research on all aspects so will post all interesting items and articles up that i find.
Post 638653 by smithy on 2013-08-26 20:18:43
From what I have heard you can still fit the 3in maf and me7 injectors with the standard setup and you can run the standard turbo upto 15 psi .i also heard that the standard intercooler with take 250 bhp no probs .also the car will be better on fuel with the me7 injectors too.
Post 641470 by artfulflounder on 2013-09-04 21:03:08
Had a little prang....nothing major new grill, headlight glass couple of support brackets so i popped down local breakers.
As luck would have it managed to get all the bits i needed and also found a complete airbox with a brand new volvo panel filter so i got that too.
In the mean time i'd ordered a digital multimeter and some K-type thermocouples thought i'd do a very basic experiment first off.
Being my daily driver a fair bit of my driving is start stop town driving and after a while the old bus struggles so thought i'd measure the under bonnet temperature at the cone filter.
I placed a thermocouple next to the cone filter....so between back of headlight and turbo......at idle it reached a maximum of 81.4*C averaging out about 76*.
During start stop city driving ranging from 58* to high 70s.....mmmm :slap:
Yes cone filter makes a nice sound and looks cool under the bonnet but completely useless for my every day driving, all that heat being sucked through the inlet....mmm can't be good. I will follow up with readings after turbo and before throttlebody with various set ups and mods but something drastic had to be done so.....
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/retro%20rides/20130904_143019_zps73eb11a6.jpg" alt="Image">[/IMG]
I've removed all the foam from the lid of the airbox....well what was left, seemed quite a bit stuck to the AMM screen.lol
Removed all the foam in the bottom which i presume is sound deadening, removed the inner trumpet from the wing intake pipe and dremmeled the intake pipe inside the box so now the AMM is the first restriction size wise in the intake system.
Not managed to do a temperature test on intake temp comparisons between the cone filter and airbox yet but should be interesting as 3* decrease in intake temp is approx 1bhp so airbox by all rights will have improved things no end.
Bit boring i know but it gives me something to do when i've not got time to tinker due to kids and i might actually learn something along the way. As well as give the old girl some more poke which is always good.
Post 662502 by artfulflounder on 2013-11-21 22:45:03
Still lovin the old girl.....trying to keep her marching on. On the whole its going alright.
This is a bit of a budget runner so you'll have to excuse me for my tightness.lol
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/retro%20rides/20131030_154810_zpsb8004c53.jpg" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Did some research and looked at all the ebay intercoolers piping and such like and ended up going with an isuzu npr intercooler.
very much the same size as a standard volvo one but with better flow and efficiency.
I know its a second hand truck intercooler but they were a well recieved upgrade in years gone by.
I did flush it out before offering it up....went on well even using standard volvo piping and car is certainly more responsive but just need to finish it properly before i put more pics on.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Now the bad bit...[/COLOR]
Did another oil change....mmm car has 240k mls on her and think she's been neglected abit. just don't know how bad the oil sludge may be after all these years, have run an oil flush through each time hoping it will be helping.
Getting a bit of positive crankcase pressure again and i've gone through the pcv system so ordered an engine compression gauge kit so i can see what the damage is.....:slap:
Possibly with the miles it could be rings or head but i'm gonna give it a go and replace /service any parts on this engine rather then swap another lump in.....gotta learn somehow as i've not gone any deeper than valve stem seals on a mk3 escort or rings and pistons on my bikes 20 odd years ago.lol
I'll post up the readings when the bits get here,i cant do a leak down test as no compressor but i believe if one cylinder reads low ( 15% or more ????) if a put a smidgen of oil in there doesn't it seal the ring enough to raise psi on a retest..if it doesn't then its the head..yes:confused::help:
I've got 10w40 synthetic in but thought i could even get away with another oil flush and 15w40 maybe if the readings aren't too low and that may help...or is that being too tight???
I told you i was a noob.....
OOOOh if anyone has an A or V cam from a b2** 8v n/a then i may be interested.....:dgrin:
Post 662517 by smithy on 2013-11-21 23:35:33
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;662502]Still lovin the old girl.....trying to keep her marching on. On the whole its going alright.
This is a bit of a budget runner so you'll have to excuse me for my tightness.lol
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/retro%20rides/20131030_154810_zpsb8004c53.jpg" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Did some research and looked at all the ebay intercoolers piping and such like and ended up going with an isuzu npr intercooler.
very much the same size as a standard volvo one but with better flow and efficiency.
I know its a second hand truck intercooler but they were a well recieved upgrade in years gone by.
I did flush it out before offering it up....went on well even using standard volvo piping and car is certainly more responsive but just need to finish it properly before i put more pics on.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Now the bad bit...[/COLOR]
Did another oil change....mmm car has 240k mls on her and think she's been neglected abit. just don't know how bad the oil sludge may be after all these years, have run an oil flush through each time hoping it will be helping.
Getting a bit of positive crankcase pressure again and i've gone through the pcv system so ordered an engine compression gauge kit so i can see what the damage is.....:slap:
Possibly with the miles it could be rings or head but i'm gonna give it a go and replace /service any parts on this engine rather then swap another lump in.....gotta learn somehow as i've not gone any deeper than valve stem seals on a mk3 escort or rings and pistons on my bikes 20 odd years ago.lol
I'll post up the readings when the bits get here,i cant do a leak down test as no compressor but i believe if one cylinder reads low ( 15% or more ????) if a put a smidgen of oil in there doesn't it seal the ring enough to raise psi on a retest..if it doesn't then its the head..yes:confused::help:
I've got 10w40 synthetic in but thought i could even get away with another oil flush and 15w40 maybe if the readings aren't too low and that may help...or is that being too tight???
I told you i was a noob.....
OOOOh if anyone has an A or V cam from a b2** 8v n/a then i may be interested.....:dgrin:[/QUOTE]
I would check the head gasket because they are prone to go if running higher boost .best put a head gasket in it and get the head skimmed why you there.
Post 663809 by artfulflounder on 2013-11-25 22:07:43
[QUOTE=smithy;662517]I would check the head gasket because they are prone to go if running higher boost .best put a head gasket in it and get the head skimmed why you there.[/QUOTE]
Yeah had a look through over the weekend and defo loosing coolant so head gasket it is......my compression tester turned up today so will still take some readings anyway.
So this is an opportunity to have a go at some upgrading/tinkering......:shhh:
Will be my first attempt at port matching and some basic smoothing and polishing. Google books has 'David Vizards- how to port and flow test cylinder heads' very educational read. i Certainly won't be doing too indepth. JUST THE BASICS.
Ideal time to change the T cam..... here's cam specs for b2** 8v engine.
http://www.turbobricks.com/resources.php?content=camspec
So if anyone has a slotted A cam pleeeeease message me.
Injectors changed to bosch 830s (blue t5)....the lh2.4 can adapt to injectors up to 42-46Lbs/hr without needing 3" amm so even at 3.8 bar these should be sufficient for a 16t/15g.
That will be a good start anyway...
Post 668119 by graemewelch on 2013-12-10 21:19:43
i use pound shop degreaser everytime i do a engine rebuild. works a treat.
Post 675872 by Biff on 2013-12-30 22:36:20
Coming on a treat mate, these older volvo's have opened my eyes.
I want one. :)
Post 675919 by stribo on 2013-12-31 00:36:27
Some good progress being made, obviously I can't comment on the figures, as I have no idea, Smithy's your man for that.
Post 675923 by MoleT-5R on 2013-12-31 00:49:26
Nice build thread mate, thing's look to be coming along nicely I see. It may be a bit to late, but the temperature sensors you mentioned back at the beginning of your build thread, if your still looking for some Claymore was using some nice digital ones on his T5-k project, drop him a pm he'll probably be more than happy to point you in the right direction and I doubt that they would be to expensive, in fact they were probably a bargain knowing Colin
Post 676230 by AndysR on 2013-12-31 22:18:35
Nice work, need to stop looking at the thread though as it's giving me ideas about modding mine... Lol
Post 676239 by artfulflounder on 2013-12-31 22:53:53
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Feel like i have to put a disclaimer in here now:[/COLOR]
Please bare in mind this is my first time doing anything to do with porting or polishing, All work is carried out in a small brick shed come workshop.The tools i have are basic but they do what they're supposed to and all i've done is researched everything i could find to set me in the right direction.
I may be doing this completely wrong and don't mind you guys giving your input.
BUT i am going to gasket match the manifolds, turbo and clean up the head anyway, because i've never had the chance to before and if i do it properly then i'll be doing my 940 proud.
I started this knowing it could completely :B_censore the car up. So don't copy me i don't know what i'm doing.:hilarious
Started on the exhaust manifold tonight. Made a template and scribed the shape onto the manifold outlet.
As i'm fitting a 15g i made sure not to go too large so the template fell within the size of a ported hotside.
This is what i started with.
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2013-12-31214913_zps293ec411.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Took some time to get used to it but progressed slowly. Just kept reminding myself you can always take more off but can't put it back. lots of ciggie breaks and checking.
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2013-12-31215003_zps1d236d82.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Still got some more time to spend on the shape/size but it started to get interesting. The shape of the runners became more pronounced and could start shaping those as well.
The cross shaped thing at the back is a 'goilet'. It assists in improving the merging of multiple flows into one flowstream.
It looks like theres some improvements to help redirect flow to the centre of the turbine inlet.
Will have a go at that tomorrow and post up the next set of pics.
Sorry if this is going to be a long winded project thread, but i learnt a few things i never knew and why not share.:insane:
Post 676244 by merc85 on 2013-12-31 23:22:40
looks good mate ;)
Post 676330 by smithy on 2014-01-01 13:28:12
That looks about right mate I bored a big hole in mine too .works well with a t4 on it .but next year I will be going tubular manifold .with that I should see 148bhp then .
Post 676331 by stribo on 2014-01-01 13:32:48
[QUOTE=smithy;676330]That looks about right mate I bored a big hole in mine too .works well with a t4 on it .but next year I will be going tubular manifold .[COLOR="#FF0000"]with that I should see 148bhp then[/COLOR] .[/QUOTE]
What's that as whp? ;)
Post 676478 by smithy on 2014-01-01 19:35:30
[QUOTE=stribo;676331]What's that as whp? ;)[/QUOTE]
No bhp
To make peeps happy lol
Post 676560 by wiganer31 on 2014-01-01 22:05:23
looking good mate, sounds like your doing similar to what i'm thinking so handy for me haha, picked up a 16t the a few weeks ago and the guy gave me some white injectors and a adj fpr so hopefully i can use them but not looked into proper yet
Post 676587 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-01 22:48:45
The 16t will fit very well, oil and water lines fit straight up, just needs clocking for rwd, but you'll have to change the down pipe flange probably.
Think it will be flat or angled. A wide band 02 would be needed to keep tabs on your fueling.
Hurry up and start on ur head so i can learn by your mistakes.lol
Post 676588 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-01 22:54:58
[QUOTE=smithy;676330]works well with a t4 on it .but next year I will be going tubular manifold .with that I should see 148bhp then .[/QUOTE]
Don't think I'll go further than the td04 series....supporting mods are more than I could justify and 19t will get high 200s which would do me fine eventually.
But if you do have a clear out then I'll be happy to accept charity.lol
Post 676836 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-02 23:01:49
Still waiting for the long shank burr so had a go at the other end of the runners.
Used a new gasket to mark the manifold.
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2014-01-02221111_zpsa5d8daa0.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2014-01-02221352_zps7ecf8f36.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Tapered the runner so i could just see the outside of my marks then blended that in gradually. Ran over any seems i felt inside but again need the longer burr then running over with flapper and polishing.
Post 677102 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-03 20:32:45
Got to the same stage with the other pair of runners tonight.
I've measured them and they all seem pretty much similar.
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2014-01-03194551_zps38f4dfbf.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/2014-01-03194701_zps157a0310.png" alt="Image">[/IMG]
Quite happy with it so far,need to get in with a flapper and sanding rolls to smooth them out a bit more, half the knack is getting used to what the tool is doing.......glad i decided to do the manifold first.
Been continuing with my research......reading about exhaust reversion. whether its less relevant to a turbo and all that hu ha.
Basically if i do match the head then its better to be smaller on the exit port.
I don't always comment on peoples threads but been some good info on here recently.
M-R-P with his oil catch tank......i was actually researching this for the 940. Don't want to vent to atmosphere really. So i can can tap out the pcv seperator outlet and fit larger pipe with catch tank.
Tap a second smaller hose from the pcv so would have 2 outlets both to catch tank(15mm standard--12mm secondary)..... or some even tap into rocker cover for an extra feed( would have to be baffled).
Stribo with his downpipe and wideband boss fitment. Again something i'm looking at now so i know what i'm doing and have all the bits when i need them. As this also effects Woodys thread.
Woody T5 with his 3.8 bar fpr.....again something i'll need to sort. With a 15g and white injectors defo require more than 3bar.So i've found out what else i can fit. which is a bonus.
Anyone going to fit an adjustable frp.lol
All good info......cheers to all that contribute on the forum.
Post 677104 by merc85 on 2014-01-03 20:34:28
Looks like your doing a top job there buddy :B_thumb:
Reminds me of when I did my t5's head
[ATTACH=CONFIG]23408[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]23409[/ATTACH]
Post 677162 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-03 21:46:17
[QUOTE=merc85;677104]Looks like your doing a top job there buddy :B_thumb:
Reminds me of when I did my t5's head
[/QUOTE]
cheers mate...
did you notice any change after you'd done it? Spool any faster, change power range.
Post 677174 by merc85 on 2014-01-03 21:59:24
seemed to rev free'er, not sure if it made much power difference but it boosted 2 psi more and was better on fuel picked up better to, but I did overhaul the head and skim it whilst it was all apart. deffo recommend doing it, I left the texture around the head of the valves and spark plugs in the combustion chamber, ive read that if you polish this area it can disturb the fuel/air mixture and make the car fuel badly as it doest atomise as well.
Also peeps cut the valve guides, I didn't do this either as I was doing it all by hand and had no means of doing so.
Post 677202 by smithy on 2014-01-03 22:52:48
Nice work mate keep it going .
Post 677206 by graemewelch on 2014-01-03 23:09:58
some very nice work there.
merc you got any more pics of your head. cylinderhead i mean
Post 677209 by Kingsford G on 2014-01-03 23:41:20
Nice project there mate,the port-polishing going really well by the look of it.
Post 677213 by merc85 on 2014-01-04 00:09:51
[QUOTE=graemewelch;677206]some very nice work there.
merc you got any more pics of your head. cylinderhead i mean[/QUOTE]
yes bud what pics you want? here's a link I don't wana trash this thread doh
http://www.vpcuk.org/forums/showthread.php?47326-855-t5-Project
Post 677244 by Jim S70R on 2014-01-04 10:49:11
Blimey that's some good progress you've made, polishing looks really good you should certainly be pleased with that, looking forward to the next update.
Post 677769 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-05 19:02:38
6.5hrs spent on turbine housing so far.
Got the portal size pretty much there for the enlarged manifold.
working on the waste gate port and improving the flow to it. More flow through waste gate port and in turn reduced exhaust back pressure. Hopefully anyway.
Kept plenty of wall thickness so not gone about it like bull in a China shop.lol
Got to say it's very therapeutic.
Post 677816 by smithy on 2014-01-05 20:10:32
Good will be nice to see the car and figuires when done .should go very well indeed matey .
Post 677925 by LiamT4 on 2014-01-05 22:52:12
Coming along nicely.
Post 677931 by smithy on 2014-01-05 23:01:37
Very nice write up
Post 677932 by LiamT4 on 2014-01-05 23:03:41
Sorry if I've missed this, but is it still an auto?
Post 677945 by wiganer31 on 2014-01-06 01:55:55
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;676587]The 16t will fit very well, oil and water lines fit straight up, just needs clocking for rwd, but you'll have to change the down pipe flange probably.
Think it will be flat or angled. A wide band 02 would be needed to keep tabs on your fueling.
Hurry up and start on ur head so i can learn by your mistakes.lol[/QUOTE]
yea thats what im hopeing for a nice simple swap but we will see how that works out lol. ahh cheers for that i will start looking into a wide band if its something i will need, still need to look into the fueling side of things, got a set of whites and a adj fuel reg so far, i know myself round a set of spanners but this kinda stuff is abit above my head.
im not sure ive got the balls to do the head if im honest haha, you will be fine, you seem to know your stuff, hopefully you dont make no mistakes though lol, looks like your doing some good work so far! good luck
cheers
Post 677950 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-06 07:01:42
[QUOTE=LiamT4;677932]Sorry if I've missed this, but is it still an auto?[/QUOTE]
Yes it's still an auto...With the accumulator mod and an extra external oil cooler the aw71 can cope with over 300bhp on a daily driver.
its high revs that kill them....so no more than 6300rpm ish so that'll be fine with most td04s.
Post 678003 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-06 14:29:07
Just pre warning you that you can skip this post if not interested in maths.lol
I thought i'd try and plot my 940 for the 15g. Used the links in previous post for instructions how to use the compressor maps
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/42249343-970f-42b9-9edb-821aa8025f23_zpsd58b500b.gif" alt="Image">[/IMG]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]How much fly wheel horse power can the 15g supply[/COLOR]....well...it takes Approximately 1 LB/MIN to support 10 flywheel horse power.
so to convert lb/min to cfm divide by 14.27. Max flow as above for the 15g is 428cfm / 14.27 = 29.99 lb/min.
Multiply this by 10 and apparently able to sustain 299.9 crank horse power.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Determining how fast a turbo will spool[/COLOR]....now to see how fast it will spool to a certain boost level.
Left hand side of plot is pressure ratio. to determin this it is simply: Boost required + 14.7 divided by 14.7 = Pressure ratio.
so 14.7 + 14.7 / 14.7 = 2.0 Pressure ratio.
So now i want to know how quickly the turbo could potentially spool to 14.7psi. I used the calculator link in my previous post to determine cfm at any given rpm.
I entered the requested fields as below for my application.
Size of engine = 2.3
VE = 85
Maximum boost we want to hit = 14.7
Maximum engine rpm =6300
This then gives a list of flow against rpm and pressure values.
If i draw a line across the map from the 2.0 pr value it first hits the map at about 120 cfm. Using the flow calulator at 120cfm and 14.7 psi.......so apparently the 15g has potential to reach 14.7 psi at 1700 rpm on my 940.
But using the compressor map calculations again for peak figures at 6300rpm needs to flow 432.2cfm on the verge of 60% efficiency......going to be reaching the limits of the 15g.
Thats was my first attempt so don't know if these figures are anywhere near the ball park.
Post 678020 by T5frankie on 2014-01-06 15:36:07
you wont get a 15g to 300bhp mate maybe 280 at a push
Post 678080 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-06 20:00:18
[QUOTE=T5frankie;678020]you wont get a 15g to 300bhp mate maybe 280 at a push[/QUOTE]
Thats what i thought when i wrote it....but that is the turbo itself not necessarily in the volvo fitment.
I did look into this as i thought all the above was wrong. What i found was something like a toyota gt starlet didn't max out the flow and could quite happily run at 22psi and still be over 73% efficient.
Post 678085 by smithy on 2014-01-06 20:08:52
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;678080]Thats what i thought when i wrote it....but that is the turbo itself not necessarily in the volvo fitment.
I did look into this as i thought all the above was wrong. What i found was something like a toyota gt starlet didn't max out the flow and could quite happily run at 22psi and still be over 73% efficient.[/QUOTE]
Yes but a 2.3 redblock has got a larger displacement compared to a starlet mate .
Post 678093 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-06 20:26:12
[QUOTE=smithy;678085]Yes but a 2.3 redblock has got a larger displacement compared to a starlet mate .[/QUOTE]
I know, i'm not arguing with frankie or you. :scared:
The calculation was for the approx max 15g fly wheel horse power. regardless of what car it was fitted to. was in no way implying that i could get that from the 940.
And in the case of the starlets then yes it can sustain a gnats winkey off 300.
Post 678098 by AndysR on 2014-01-06 20:41:35
Looking good so far, you may want to get something done about the crack up to the wastegate port though as you could end up with sealing issues with the wastegate penny and this will lead to boost loss :(
Post 678105 by smithy on 2014-01-06 21:17:12
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;678093]I know, i'm not arguing with frankie or you. :scared:
The calculation was for the approx max 15g fly wheel horse power. regardless of what car it was fitted to. was in no way implying that i could get that from the 940.
And in the case of the starlets then yes it can sustain a gnats winkey off 300.[/QUOTE]
I'm not arguing at all mate lol .just stating that the starlets don't need a big turbo to get that amount of power .it is possible to run a 15g at 18/20psi if you got a good intercooler and the fueling of course .but it's not all about bhp its torque that you will produce .and that will be loads being an 8v .
Post 678334 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-07 18:52:34
[QUOTE=AndysR;678098]Looking good so far, you may want to get something done about the crack up to the wastegate port though as you could end up with sealing issues with the wastegate penny and this will lead to boost loss :([/QUOTE]
Yeah I was concerned about that, but as there was no issues with previous owner I was hoping the better flow into wastegate might make life abit easier. Only going to run to 15psi.....
if it does cause issues just means I'm going to have to speed up my plans for a 3" dp and do all that work over again on a flat or angled housing.lol
Post 678344 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-07 19:20:30
Need to get a pair of circlip pliers ordered to take the compressor housing off.
Any pointers to what I need? Size wise or what you have used.
cheers guys
Post 678473 by wiganer31 on 2014-01-08 03:09:35
i removed the circlip off two turbos easy enough with only a long reach pair of long nose pliers with a 90 deg bend in them, not ideal i know but it was all i had at the time and it worked and caused no damage, im not saying use that idea but at the time i only had access to a local hardware shop and there circlip pliers were pathetic so i just made do with what i had,
cheers
Post 678477 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 06:44:16
What is the 14.7 value you are using above mate? Maybe should be 14.5
Post 678483 by M-R-P on 2014-01-08 08:15:48
Someone say Starlet? :shifty:
Post 678489 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-08 08:57:29
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678477]What is the 14.7 value you are using above mate? Maybe should be 14.5[/QUOTE]
Absolute pressure at sea level is 14.7 psia.Which is 1.02 bar so to make it easier for people to measure 1 bar we use 14.5 psi.
Post 678491 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-08 09:00:49
[QUOTE=M-R-P;678483]Someone say Starlet? :shifty:[/QUOTE]
Please dont tell the mods ill get banned for using profanities.lol
Post 678492 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 09:13:00
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;678489]Absolute pressure at sea level is 14.7 psia.Which is 1.02 bar so to make it easier for people to measure 1 bar we use 14.5 psi.[/QUOTE]
I thought you were converting to 1 bar using 14.7, cos it should be 14.5 psi or a bit less than 1 atmosphere as you say. Pedantic I know but there is only 1 way to do a job :D
I liked the flywheel hp calc, tried it with my 16T numbers (435 CFM, 17.4 psi) and it said to me don't waste your time with an 18T/485 CFM :)
Post 678524 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-08 10:46:18
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678492]Pedantic I know but there is only 1 way to do a job :D[/QUOTE]
The only way i seem to do a job is jump in with both feet way above my head, post info that i previously knew nothing about and hope people don't ask questions.
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678492]I liked the flywheel hp calc, tried it with my 16T numbers (435 CFM, 17.4 psi) and it said to me don't waste your time with an 18T/485 CFM :)[/QUOTE]
I've found this weirdly addictive.....found myself looking at t3/t4 hybrids using the t4 compressor map and things like td05-16g just to see what they work out like....even though i know i need to use the 15g until i've got more supporting mods sorted.:redface:
Post 678525 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 10:58:11
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;678524]The only way i seem to do a job is jump in with both feet way above my head, post info that i previously knew nothing about and hope people don't ask questions.
I've found this weirdly addictive.....found myself looking at t3/t4 hybrids using the t4 compressor map and things like td05-16g just to see what they work out like....even though i know i need to use the 15g until i've got more supporting mods sorted.:redface:[/QUOTE]
Just recently there was a guy on the Volvo 480 forum asking questions about his 1.7 B18FT engine with a T34 turbo attached, remember, more is more! Mine is an auto and a daily driver so I think the straight outlet 18T I picked up from the scrappy can stay where is is for now.....I got it just before reading this.....
[I]Mounting a big turbo on a car with automatic gearbox can result in slow response and poor take off.
Bosch M4.x variants with automatic gearbox is good for the straight outlet 16T. Mounting the straight outlet 18T in a car with Bosch M4.x system will give noticeable losses in take off performance and the TCM will also shift up too soon and the real use of the 18T compressor is lost.
It's the same principal for the P2 platform, but with a good combination of HW I have managed to get very good result also with 19T in an automatic S60 T5, but take off performance is still slightly affected.
General advise is to stay at size 16 for an automatic car if you now that you are going to use the car for city traffic or often use trailer.[/I]
from here http://www.wothrline.com/Cars_engine/HW/turbocharger.htm
ho hum
Post 678540 by smithy on 2014-01-08 12:16:22
I have a t4 on my 940 but I have suporting mods to go with it though .remember the bigger ther the turbo the bigger breathing mods you need to do too.like bigger tb and bigger piping etc.an 18t does make a big difference with a 960 tb .
Post 678542 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 12:26:21
[QUOTE=smithy;678540]I have a t4 on my 940 but I have suporting mods to go with it though .remember the bigger ther the turbo the bigger breathing mods you need to do too.like bigger tb and bigger piping etc.an 18t does make a big difference with a 960 tb .[/QUOTE]
thanks good info, I'll hold onto the 18T for now then :D
Post 678545 by smithy on 2014-01-08 12:35:29
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678542]thanks good info, I'll hold onto the 18T for now then :D[/QUOTE]
The bigger the turbo with the standard tb the power band is pushed up the rev range .thats why putting a 960tb with 65mm tb instead of standard 55 mm makes a difference .and best to use the bigger piping too .
Post 678554 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 12:45:47
[QUOTE=smithy;678545]The bigger the turbo with the standard tb the power band is pushed up the rev range .thats why putting a 960tb with 65mm tb instead of standard 55 mm makes a difference .and best to use the bigger piping too .[/QUOTE]
I have a ported cylinder head to go on, and a bigger intercooler with 63 mm connections. Graeme W is knocking up some piping for me so that just leaves the throttle body and the turbo as the restrictions........maybe MAF also eventually but one job at a time though, no good chucking it all on it once
Post 678579 by T5frankie on 2014-01-08 14:09:43
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678525]Just recently there was a guy on the Volvo 480 forum asking questions about his 1.7 B18FT engine with a T34 turbo attached, remember, more is more! Mine is an auto and a daily driver so I think the straight outlet 18T I picked up from the scrappy can stay where is is for now.....I got it just before reading this.....
[I]Mounting a big turbo on a car with automatic gearbox can result in slow response and poor take off.
Bosch M4.x variants with automatic gearbox is good for the straight outlet 16T. Mounting the straight outlet 18T in a car with Bosch M4.x system will give noticeable losses in take off performance and the TCM will also shift up too soon and the real use of the 18T compressor is lost.
It's the same principal for the P2 platform, but with a good combination of HW I have managed to get very good result also with 19T in an automatic S60 T5, but take off performance is still slightly affected.
General advise is to stay at size 16 for an automatic car if you now that you are going to use the car for city traffic or often use trailer.[/I]
from here http://www.wothrline.com/Cars_engine/HW/turbocharger.htm
ho hum[/QUOTE]
I swapped a 15g for an 18t on my old 850r auto and it went like stink, you won't notice any change at the bottom but it pushes harder at the top end
Post 678581 by partsforvolvos.com on 2014-01-08 14:18:52
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678525]Just recently there was a guy on the Volvo 480 forum asking questions about his 1.7 B18FT engine with a T34 turbo attached, remember, more is more! Mine is an auto and a daily driver so I think the straight outlet 18T I picked up from the scrappy can stay where is is for now.....I got it just before reading this.....
[I]Mounting a big turbo on a car with automatic gearbox can result in slow response and poor take off.
Bosch M4.x variants with automatic gearbox is good for the straight outlet 16T. Mounting the straight outlet 18T in a car with Bosch M4.x system will give noticeable losses in take off performance and the TCM will also shift up too soon and the real use of the 18T compressor is lost.
It's the same principal for the P2 platform, but with a good combination of HW I have managed to get very good result also with 19T in an automatic S60 T5, but take off performance is still slightly affected.
General advise is to stay at size 16 for an automatic car if you now that you are going to use the car for city traffic or often use trailer.[/I]
from here http://www.wothrline.com/Cars_engine/HW/turbocharger.htm
ho hum[/QUOTE]
yes, that's why early d5 autos are rubbish. there is a definite 1-2 second delay before you move off. worse on awd like the xc90 - we used to get complaints they were dangerous, but in reality they are not, you learn to drive differently.
Post 678583 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 14:38:22
Thanks for comments Frankie & Jamie, I think an 18T with as much restrictions removed as possible might be the answer. And a gearbox from a 2 litre :D
edit: sorry Mr Flounder for thread hijack!! Hope my ramblings were useful in some way, or at least the replies by the more experienced guys were!
Post 678606 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-08 17:05:48
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;678583]
edit: sorry Mr Flounder for thread hijack!! Hope my ramblings were useful in some way, or at least the replies by the more experienced guys were![/QUOTE]
No worries ..... bit gutted thought I might be able to pick up a cheap 18t from ya.lol
Oh well I'll have to settle for your 16t instead.lol
With 850 guys using 4.4 now is TCM not one of the changable parameters via tunerpro?
Post 678614 by jamesy12345 on 2014-01-08 17:22:06
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;678606]No worries ..... bit gutted thought I might be able to pick up a cheap 18t from ya.lol
Oh well I'll have to settle for your 16t instead.lol
With 850 guys using 4.4 now is TCM not one of the changable parameters via tunerpro?[/QUOTE]
The 18T needs a refurbish by the look of it, won't be going anywhere for a while!
Post 681451 by artfulflounder on 2014-01-18 13:53:58
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;680434]
The redblocks have notoriously small valves, exhaust especially but thats something that i can't remedy with the funds i have available. Just going to try make the best out of what i've got.[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry but again i don't think thats a good enough explanation so again spent some time researching for actual data and facts so i know why.
As i'm about to start the head refurb on my 940 thought i should find out what is the best approach.
This post is like a one sided debate with myself, this is just theory with no personal experience to back any of it up.
All the information given below is a collection from as many sources that i could find. It could be useful as a guideline for others as to what the short falls of the b2** cylinder heads are.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]General rules of thumb for flow and valve size[/COLOR]
Valve Area Determines Horsepower
The piston creates a vacuum as it moves down the cylinder during the intake stroke. The atmosphere pushes air into this vacuum through the intake valve. The faster the piston moves the faster the air has to flow through the intake valve. so basically "The faster you rev your engine, the faster the air has to flow through the intake."
1) The faster you rev your engine, the more power you will make UNTIL the intake air speed reaches max flow.
2) The larger the intake valve, the faster you can rev your engine before the intake air speed reaches max flow.
YOUR ENGINE'S MAXIMUM POWER IS DETERMINED BY YOUR INTAKE VALVE AREA.
Valve area determines total potential horsepower and displacement determines how fast your engine has to rev to produce maximum power.
Below are flow figures for a standard volvo 530 cylinder head taken at 28" water.
Lift Intake: Exhaust:
.050 24.2 17.4
.100 51.3 36.5
.150 77.8 56.4
.200 105.2 75.1
.250 129.3 89.3
.300 143.4 99.2
.350 150.4 106.5
.400 155.1 113.5
.450 159.7 118.6
.500 161.6 122.0
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Volvo SOHC heads[/COLOR] by Mike Aaro
First of all:
There is no such thing as a best or "big port" oem head...
The Volvo sohc engine has two distinctively types of oem head-designs :
The little one, most common
The big one
The little one:
Oem on: B17-B19-B21-B23 B200-B230
Valves: 44-35 mm, valve seat inserts 46-38 mm.
Combustion chamber dia: 92½mm, somewhat smaller/narrower compared to the big ones
Height: 12mm
Volume: 51.7cc i.e. 4.3cc/mm
Intake channel: Straight, conical, round, slightly less inner radius
Exhaust channel: A slight hint of a plateau after guide in channel
Casting number, best: 1000530
Other: 100160, 1000398
Potential: Correctly modifyed: Good top-hp with a very good middle-rpm. On little engine hard to beat, indeed.
The big one:
Oem on: early B23E with H/K-cams, B23ET some B230E and ET
Valves: 44-35 mm, valve seat inserts 46-38 mm
Combustion chamber dia: 94mm, a slightly wider layout especially around exhaust, 531 has a little more centered spark plug location.
Height: 12mm
Volume: 53.7cc i.e. 4.5cc/mm
Intake channel: "Swanneck"-shaped, venturi A LOT larger than the small ones, flat and larger inner radius,
Exhaust channel: No hint of a plateau after guide in channel
Castingnumber, best: 1000531
Other: 100405
Potential: Correctly modifyed: Very high top-hp with a good middle-rpm, especially on big volume engines.
So these are the two cylinder heads readily available the 530 & 531......valve sizes are the same, infact they didn't even change valve size from n/a to the turbo, just fitted sodium filled valves to the exhaust.
The biggest recognised restriction to these heads is well known to be the exhaust port. I've included a pic below of cross section of 405 head but all same.
[IMG]http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab125/matie69/940%20engine%20refurb/405_ut_std_zpsb3b849c0.jpg" alt="Image">[/IMG]
The small valve sizes do nothing for high end power but do assist with midrange and lowend torque.
Oem inserts allow 46-38 mm valves to be used and the largest combination 50.5-40mm or a combination there of (as in 90.5 included diameter).
Largest valve combination: 50½-40 mm or a combination thereof (as in 90.5mm included dia).
Below is another very informative link for the 530 vs 531 theory. It includes info on the different combustion chambers ,oem valve springs used and some very useful information:
http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~amh110/Head/cylinder_head_531_530.htm
So from what i've been able to understand so far is that yes the 531 head does have a better intake side and will ultimately flow more, BUT that is only at the higher revs......so in my application of ultimately a 300bhp automatic then a 530 head will have more mid range and more than capable of being sufficient.
If i wanted more say 350-400bhp about max for 8v head (without serious cash invested) and had a higher reving manual then a 531 would be more beneficial. At a certain point then the funds to make more power from the 8v is easier done with a 16v head swap.
So the BEST head to have is the one that best suits your individual application.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Cams and springs:[/COLOR]
An interesting note on the choice of heads was the cam options......A well ported/filled 530 will make more power than a 531 anyday with a cam under 12.5mm. If going to a bigger cam, make the jump for the 531/405 heads.
So what cams are available and what about specifications, well as it happens here is another link with the information you may be after.
http://www.turbobricks.com/resources.php?content=camspec
Valve springs are another thing that people automatically feel the need to change.
Yes i'll be changing mine out for a new set of oem ones but they are more than capable of coping until you exceed the standard rev limit on the engine...if you want to run 7k rpm plus, or with a safety factor 6500k but with the aggressive cam profile.
If however you have changed your standard valve size then a stiffer spring rate may be required for the weight of the valves.
So with respect to a 8v head with standard valve sizes then little benefit will be seen from any porting work.
Clearing up the castings on the ports and polishing the exhaust side may give a few cfm. BUT no matter how much air you can flow in it still has to go out through a restrictive 35mm exhaust port.
Post 686568 by artfulflounder on 2014-02-02 21:17:42
Finished all porting on manifolds. took them round to local car wash and they steam cleaned them for free while they were doing a customers car, which i thought was very nice of them.
Having had little responce in another thread i've purchased some 1000 deg c paint from various sources and am going to do the exhaust manifold, turbine housing and compressor side. Got a catering oven in my shed that i picked up for free so i can properly cure the paint. But will have to see how it goes.
Also got paint for inlet manifold ,rocker cover,thermostat housing, waterpump and enamel for engine block. as i see it if its less cluttered in engine bay may as well paint, clean and refresh anything i can get too. (might worry graham in the cleanliness stakes.lol)
Spring compressor turned up so also attacking the head presently.
Checked the valve clearances and even after 250k only 2 of them are at max end of tolerance.
The valve springs were also checked for sag along with valve stem diameter.
When i took the buckets out the hushers? were absolutely shagged.
Did my homework on the port throats and have started gasket matching and polishing.
Will post pics up before and during when i've made some progress.
Thanks to [COLOR="#FF0000"]PFV[/COLOR] for their regular excellent service for my head gasket set, water pump and thermostat, plus other sundries.
Ordered a new radiator just because mine does look a bit crusty.
Post 686579 by LiamT4 on 2014-02-02 21:31:30
Your being very thorough, well done. Looking forward to when its all done.
Post 686581 by AndysR on 2014-02-02 21:32:33
Great progress by the sounds of things :)
Post 687007 by iancho on 2014-02-04 14:46:34
Super thread and very in-depth! it's always good when you have pictures to relate too :)
Post 689229 by 7mgtesup on 2014-02-13 12:19:13
Are you still looking for a cam? I have a VX3 which is a pretty nice improvement over a T cam (I made 280whp with it) if you want it?
On the potential of an 8v head you need to look at this thread http://www.turbobricks.org/forums/showthread.php?t=286614
Slightly ported head (531) stock valves, reground cam and made 673hp
The Holset HX50 @38psi might have helped though.
Post 692000 by M-R-P on 2014-02-27 13:14:16
Good work there mate, watching with interest :)
Post 693610 by artfulflounder on 2014-03-07 10:56:45
Completed all the work I'm going to do on the head now.
Made a heath robinson washer tank with my neighbours recycling bin.He never used it anyway.lol
Also had it skimmed....so presently all ready for reassembly. Yay.
I also pinched his black vegetable bin as it looks ideal to be trimmed down and used for my cone filter heat shield.
Now a tale of warning for you all.
If your misses tells you that she is going shopping with her friend and wont be back till late afternoon, dont think that you can put your freshly painted 1000°c engine bits in the oven to cure.
Its all a lie, she will come home several hours early and catch you then make you clean the kitchen to get rid of the smell as it hasn't had time to dissipate.
But its o.k as you can feel rather smug while doing it satisfied with that your parts came out well.
Post 693611 by Harvey on 2014-03-07 11:08:35
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;693610]
Now a tale of warning for you all.
If your misses tells you that she is going shopping with her friend and wont be back till late afternoon, dont think that you can put your freshly painted 1000°c engine bits in the oven to cure.
Its all a lie, she will come home several hours early and catch you then make you clean the kitchen to get rid of the smell as it hasn't had time to dissipate.
But its o.k as you can feel rather smug while doing it satisfied with that your parts came out well.[/QUOTE]
Been their and done it.think it was 70 degrees for an hour and a half
Post 693617 by artfulflounder on 2014-03-07 11:49:54
I did 30mins at 100 then 30mins at 200.
Still got a final bake but I'll do that on the car.lol
Post 694830 by artfulflounder on 2014-03-13 21:44:25
Can sort of see me making huge steps to getting the old girl back together.
The head has been thoroughly cleaned/degreased, skimmed and lapped the valves.
Valves fitted with new stem seals and hushers.
Cheers to Paul for the vx3 cam.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]VX3 Cam:[/COLOR] Info from Anthony hyde.
This cam is featured in an old Volvo competition catalogue (the 'BLUE book' being mated to the 531 head and B230FB engine), but is not a 'competition' cam. Most agree its soft down low, but has a very sweet and flexible mid range. It pulls about 500 rpm further than other 'Volvo" cams to around 5,600 rpm and will continue to rev to 6,300 rpm, but the last 700 rpm step is slow (can depend on valve spring condition).
VX3 Spec - 11.37mm intake lift, 10.5mm exhaust lift, Intake opens at 7.7deg BTDC, has some overlap and opens the valves between 1.5 and 2 mm wider. Exhaust Opens 50.1 deg BBTC. VX3 cam has assymetric lobes, unlike the "K" cam. has some overlap and opens the valves between 1.5 and 2 mm wider. Tim Tak.
So for use in the 940 with aw71 auto it seems an ideal cam as i won't be reving much past 6k rpm anyway.
Well thats the engine work going on but also i've been getting stuck into some of the other stuff. Mostly prepping and painting odds and sods.
Thought if i had the engine all apart the i may as well at least make things look abit better.
They only do the wrinkle paint in black and red so don't presume by seeing the pic above that the rocker cover is staying black, i have painted over the black but you'll have to wait to see that......:P
The engine block, inlet manifold, compressor housing, exhaust manifold and turbine housing are also in various levels of prep and paint.
Well thats all for today.......cheers for having a browse.
Post 694985 by artfulflounder on 2014-03-14 18:55:42
Note to self:
If fitting new cam check shim gaps without new hushers fitted. Its soooo much easier.
Just take cam out and install them when you're all sorted with shims.
yeah I learnt the hard way.
Post 695013 by barkster1971 on 2014-03-14 19:56:54
You only had to ask! The hushers that are available now last a lot longer than the originals. Did you buy an Elring kit? Without them it can sound like knocking to the sensor and retardt he timing. Looking good btw.
Post 695031 by artfulflounder on 2014-03-14 20:37:05
^^^ well i forgot to ask.lol
With the hushers it made measuring feel wierd.
so I took cam back out removed hushers refitted cam. Measured gaps took cam back out and fitted hushers back.
Job done.
Yeah it was an elring head set, got some bits in there that I've still to figure out yet.
Still got to fit thermostat and waterpump too.
Post 696516 by M-R-P on 2014-03-20 12:54:01
Looking sweet mate :)
Post 696524 by gwrt5 on 2014-03-20 15:01:40
Cracking write up and cars looking great under the engine bay , would live to have your mechanical knowledge to be able to attemp something like that myself ,
Post 706483 by artfulflounder on 2014-04-26 07:32:32
Been a while but I'm still here.....been moving house so had to put halt on the old girl for a few weeks.
Back in action again now though. Cheers to the guys that I pm'd for a bit of advice.
I now have cam belt fitted along with new cam belt covers but I have modified them.
Manifold refitted with new studs and flange nuts. Volvo now deem the 940 old so dont stock parts at the dealers, I had to wait 3-10days for parts :(
The manifold support bracket was a bugger so I just cut a slot in the bracket so the manifold could slide easily into it.
Looks a bit like tarts handbag as I've cleaned the spark plug heat shields and painted coil.
Just got to make bracket for actuator then the turbo can go back on, finally make an airbox come heat shield for the cone filter.
Got some pics but not had time to go on the pc yet. Hopefully shouldnt be too long now :)
Post 706587 by barkster1971 on 2014-04-26 20:09:57
Looking excellent, I would do the valve cover red then you can see if the seal on the stopper if peeeing oil out, had mine shot blasted so it's silver and saw the oil seeping out, which you can't see if it's black. Should go well when everything is together!
Post 706588 by barkster1971 on 2014-04-26 20:10:48
Are you not binning all the egr cr@p?
Post 706650 by artfulflounder on 2014-04-26 22:16:05
[QUOTE=barkster1971;706588]Are you not binning all the egr cr@p?[/QUOTE]
I could do, what are the major benefits and is it just the valve under pcv plus pipe to manifold?
Does it not have a sensor attached so will it not throw up a code?
Decided to sort an oil catch can out now too so been looking at options.
Post 706865 by artfulflounder on 2014-04-27 19:25:33
Todays job mostly involved piss arsing about trying to line up chra with turbo drain pipe.
Post 707050 by wiganer31 on 2014-04-28 03:49:31
ahhh been wondering how this was going, dont think i will be doing as much gasket matching/porting as i first said, i haven't got the confidence, keep cracking on pal
cheers
Post 707192 by jks on 2014-04-28 17:41:02
Great thread! Keep it up!
Post 707225 by artfulflounder on 2014-04-28 19:33:43
[QUOTE=jks;707192]Great thread! Keep it up![/QUOTE]
Cheers buddy :)
If or rather when I upgrade turbo again I'll make sure to drill and tap a proper oil drain and try to get a decent custom manifold made.
Apart from 30bhp increase will mean no more struggling cause I dont have double jointed wrists with exceedingly long fingers.lol
Post 707322 by jks on 2014-04-28 23:02:41
lol, i know what You meen!
easier when its on top!
its worse, shoe horning a Holset, on std manifold! lol
Post 709156 by jks on 2014-05-05 18:44:32
Keep it up! It's good to see proper volvo's being bettered!
Post 709313 by artfulflounder on 2014-05-06 07:35:20
I was begining to think I was wasting my time posting.
Apart from a few regulars with their thanks and encouragement been no interest at all.
Thought maybe I was doing it all wrong....if I had the funds to buy a big valve ported head I would, but I dont.
So ive tried to research as much as I can and post all relevant info and specs.
Good to know people are reading it, dont feel so down hearted about not having a t5, just my humble rwd redblock.
Post 709316 by jamesy12345 on 2014-05-06 08:04:33
I've been following, fella
I wouldn't worry about who is following & who is not. Sometimes people just have nothing to add but still are interested - like me. Anyway even if no-one cares a project thread is your record of progress, so next time you do it, it should be less painful :)
Post 709318 by artfulflounder on 2014-05-06 08:36:03
[QUOTE=jamesy12345;709316]I've been following, fella
Anyway even if no-one cares a project thread is your record of progress, so next time you do it, it should be less painful :)[/QUOTE]
Cheers james
Like to do a t6 960 next to be honest...but that'll be in a few years prob.
Post 709319 by jamesy12345 on 2014-05-06 08:37:26
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;709318]Cheers james
Like to do a t6 960 next to be honest...but that'll be in a few years prob.[/QUOTE]
I'd love to do something like that but haven't got the time or the skills :) maybe one day........
Post 709428 by wiganer31 on 2014-05-06 19:59:36
that cooler fits well, good find, is your rad a non air con one?
cheers
Post 709446 by smithy on 2014-05-06 21:06:02
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;709313]I was begining to think I was wasting my time posting.
Apart from a few regulars with their thanks and encouragement been no interest at all.
Thought maybe I was doing it all wrong....if I had the funds to buy a big valve ported head I would, but I dont.
So ive tried to research as much as I can and post all relevant info and specs.
Good to know people are reading it, dont feel so down hearted about not having a t5, just my humble rwd redblock.[/QUOTE]
I've been following this thread with interest and I have never owned a t5 .keep it up and should go very well once all sorted .you don't need a big valve head to make power it's been proved time and time again .the is a guy in Sweden who got 502 whp with a stock engine just a cam ,big turbo and standalone .
Post 709457 by LiamT4 on 2014-05-06 21:19:02
Don't worry about it, t5 owners won't comment because they're all jealous of the red block engine compared to their chocolate t5 engines ;)
Seriously though, not many on here have experience of these cars so your not going to have as many comments simply due to our ignorance. Plenty of views though, so the interest is there.
Post 709470 by smithy on 2014-05-06 21:34:40
[QUOTE=LiamT4;709457]Don't worry about it, t5 owners won't comment because they're all jealous of the red block engine compared to their chocolate t5 engines ;)
Seriously though, not many on here have experience of these cars so your not going to have as many comments simply due to our ignorance. Plenty of views though, so the interest is there.[/QUOTE]
Yes not many peeps no about the mighty redblock including me .so we are all learning from this thread .
Post 709474 by LiamT4 on 2014-05-06 21:42:35
[QUOTE=smithy;709470]Yes not many peeps no about the mighty redblock including me .so we are all learning from this thread .[/QUOTE]
Apparently someone on here has a dark purple 940 with some tasty mods on, ask jamest5r as he knows the guy, he may be able to help you............although the car hasn't been seen for ages so it may just be a myth ;) lol
Post 709511 by jks on 2014-05-06 23:12:56
[QUOTE=LiamT4;709474]Apparently someone on here has a dark purple 940 with some tasty mods on, ask jamest5r as he knows the guy, he may be able to help you............although the car hasn't been seen for ages so it may just be a myth ;) lol[/QUOTE]
"It be done soon.." man said..2 years ago! lol
I know its "brewing", and it will be epic!
Post 709521 by artfulflounder on 2014-05-06 23:55:54
[QUOTE=LiamT4;709474]Apparently someone on here has a dark purple 940 with some tasty mods on, ask jamest5r as he knows the guy, he may be able to help you............although the car hasn't been seen for ages so it may just be a myth ;) lol[/QUOTE]
I hear it makes a healthy 140bhp ;)
I blame smithy it was his fault I started all this and now jks is on here I think things may progress rather well :)
Post 709534 by artfulflounder on 2014-05-07 06:56:22
[QUOTE=wiganer31;709428]that cooler fits well, good find, is your rad a non air con one?
cheers[/QUOTE]
Yeah it is. Didnt have air con to start with.
Post 709857 by wiganer31 on 2014-05-08 01:18:17
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;709534]Yeah it is. Didnt have air con to start with.[/QUOTE]
that's what i though, im now thinking i should have converted mine to that rad when the rad on mine poped, took the aircon off anyways, i like how that cooler fits on yours.
cheers
Post 717135 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-05 19:59:56
Got the new radiator fitted but found in final fitment the npr intercooler just fouled the top of the airbox.
Mmmmm....bugger.
Again probably totally worthless but my way round it was to modify the airbox so it could still be used as a heat shield and use a cone filter inside.
I cut the front panel out from the airbox that directly sits behind the headlight to allow for the extra length of the cone and also access to lots of Incoming cold air.
The 940 already has a cold air feed which runs through wing into air box, works much better when you remove the tapered restriction.
Removed the front lip of the lid to allow more space round the cone filter. Also opened up the hole for filter to amm pipe and put a decent size in there instead of the ovalised standard hose, possibly less restriction???? Who knows but the silicon hose does look better.lol
So I'm hoping I've stopped some of the heat soak while standing but still allowed for a decent airflow when ragging it.
Plus it was free.
Post 717156 by Jamest5r on 2014-06-05 21:31:59
Very nice work mate, as long as it has more than 140bhp your laughing :)
Post 717160 by 850 T5s on 2014-06-05 21:45:59
coming along nicely,great transformation in the engine bay
Post 717203 by M-R-P on 2014-06-06 07:30:07
Black n white - you know it's right :D
Bout time those pics went public mate, looks awesome.
Post 717206 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-06 08:59:03
Cheers guys :)
Filled up with fluids now, turned over without coil connected and couldnt see any leaks or strange noises.
Fingers crossed......
Once running will be straight into 3"exhaust, poly bushing frontend, dual bars on the rear plus accumulator mod for the auto.
In the mean time gonna collect parts needed for a future t3/t4 hybrid upgrade.
Not going huge as still auto so .48 cossie hotside and poss 50 trim t4.
3" maf needed and suitable injectors.
Also downloaded some xdf and bin files so can have a look at playing with lh2.4 on tunerpro.
all good stuff....:)
So as she stands including purchase price maybe spent £500 tops at this point......and thoroughly enjoyed it.
Post 717561 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-08 17:16:44
its a swede and proud!!!!!
What do you guys think to this.......took me a few attempts but I'm happy.
Just need to do a few finishing touches.
Post 718585 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-12 20:56:26
Tonights update......
YAY......new bpr7s fitted doubled checked everything and the old girl struck up straight away.
settled down quickly to a nice steady idle.
Only ran for a few minutes got to cure exhaust manifold paint.
dont seem to have any drips but will run for longer next time. I did have to slacken off waterpump and apply bit more upward pressure to seal to head but that seems fine.
God I am so relieved. ......I was dreading today, thought I'd maybe messed something up and have to strip it all down.
Bit long winded and its took 7 pages of this thread but I've now done my first ever head gasket change.lol
big thanks to everyone thats helped along the way, wouldn't have got this far without you :)
Post 718594 by smithy on 2014-06-12 21:08:24
Looks very nice mate you need to do a spec list now of what you have fitted .
Post 718596 by Shinsplintz 101 on 2014-06-12 21:09:57
Well done fella, been watching this come together, love the painting job on the rocker cover! Keep up the good work :)
Post 718884 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-14 06:58:07
Still starts fine, idles well.
I have run through idle set up and tps as I'd had all the linkages off.
Heaters blowing hot air and system seems to have bled itself.
Also theres no dancing oil cap if I rest in on. So no positive pressure, so seems that changing valve stem seals has worked.
Will be booking her in for mot very shortly :)
Post 718888 by jamesy12345 on 2014-06-14 07:27:41
Looks great that cam cover, fella, like we talked about
Love the level gauge on the catch tank btw
Post 718910 by T5RatherAmusin on 2014-06-14 12:51:53
looking good that matey!
Post 719020 by AndysR on 2014-06-14 23:55:19
Nice work, pleased to hear it's running well after the time and effort you've invested in it :)
Post 720310 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-22 12:55:56
Nearly ready for mot.......been using a private road at back of house to run the 940 up and down.
I didnt know if the 350cc injectors would make the car run rich and fail emmisions so tried to give lh enough time to re-learn.........still running at 7psi at this point but definately got more urge than the 13c did at 12psi.......so 1psi increase approx 6bhp........mmm should be a healthy increase at 14psi upwards :)
Ran through faffing about setting up idle and tps again. Had to strip down washer pumps as siezed. New wipers, but thats all I've found to attend to.
Did have concerns about the fuel pump. Does sound quite noisy so really wanting to change it very soon.
Found out that volvo pump approx 120 l/hr, divide that by 0.47 for turbo application will support 255bhp. So thats obviously new, so a 250k mile pump would struggle to cope with even my mild upgrades.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Any recommendations on an uprated pump to use?[/COLOR] most common seem to be Walbro 255. Are they an easy installation?
Quick check, 255 l/hr divide by 0.47.......should support approx 540bhp. So plenty big enough.
3 bar fpr o.k for the time being but might connsider adjustable regulator for future mods if its worth while.....again need your advice.
Post 720438 by smithy on 2014-06-22 21:33:19
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;720310]Nearly ready for mot.......been using a private road at back of house to run the 940 up and down.
I didnt know if the 350cc injectors would make the car run rich and fail emmisions so tried to give lh enough time to re-learn.........still running at 7psi at this point but definately got more urge than the 13c did at 12psi.......so 1psi increase approx 6bhp........mmm should be a healthy increase at 14psi upwards :)
Ran through faffing about setting up idle and tps again. Had to strip down washer pumps as siezed. New wipers, but thats all I've found to attend to.
Did have concerns about the fuel pump. Does sound quite noisy so really wanting to change it very soon.
Found out that volvo pump approx 120 l/hr, divide that by 0.47 for turbo application will support 255bhp. So thats obviously new, so a 250k mile pump would struggle to cope with even my mild upgrades.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Any recommendations on an uprated pump to use?[/COLOR] most common seem to be Walbro 255. Are they an easy installation?
Quick check, 255 l/hr divide by 0.47.......should support approx 540bhp. So plenty big enough.
3 bar fpr o.k for the time being but might connsider adjustable regulator for future mods if its worth while.....again need your advice.[/QUOTE]
Are you running a 3in maf
Post 720447 by artfulflounder on 2014-06-22 22:05:30
[QUOTE=smithy;720438]Are you running a 3in maf[/QUOTE]
No mate stock 016.....easier to alter chip for fuel cut then under fueling with 3" maf cause injectors arent big enough for it.
Post 720450 by 850 T5s on 2014-06-22 22:23:01
the rocker cover finishes the engine bay off a treat, excellent !!!!
Post 720451 by smithy on 2014-06-22 22:26:42
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;720447]No mate stock 016.....easier to alter chip for fuel cut then under fueling with 3" maf cause injectors arent big enough for it.[/QUOTE]
You will be fine with 350cc injectors with standard maf at 3bar.your engine bay does look nice mate
Post 722857 by artfulflounder on 2014-07-07 09:46:50
New walbro 255 fuel pump fitted, in tank fuel line......what a bugger of a job getting sender unit back into tank.
Fuel filter changed.
Volvo 760 proper 2x single din centre console purchased.
mot booked for today at 11......fingers crossed
Post 722858 by M-R-P on 2014-07-07 09:56:12
Good luck dude :)
Post 722860 by jamesy12345 on 2014-07-07 10:02:41
Good luck, show them your cam cover first, instant pass!
Post 722873 by MoleT-5R on 2014-07-07 11:29:14
Just been catching up on your superb build thread, nice work and super detailed write up makes for an interesting and different read. Keep up the good work and it will be interesting to see what this car will make on the rollers when you've finished it.
And good luck with the MOT, not that you'll really need luck going by what we can see in the build quality
Post 722915 by artfulflounder on 2014-07-07 18:09:07
Cheers for the comments guys :)
Well got the car back from mot.........
Can you believe I got an advisory: number plate deteriorated but not likely to be misread.
What a relief that was.......emmisions little bit high but ecu will still be learning for new injectors so should settle down.
Can get 3" downpipe and exhaust done now :) wideband at same time.
[SIZE=7]YAY[/SIZE]
Post 722917 by M-R-P on 2014-07-07 18:18:26
Woohoo
You may now relax your sphincter!
Post 722918 by jamesy12345 on 2014-07-07 18:28:57
Nice one fella
Post 722923 by V70 Graham on 2014-07-07 18:46:05
Well done on the pass.
Post 723693 by M-R-P on 2014-07-11 20:26:47
Nice work dude :)
Post 724593 by artfulflounder on 2014-07-17 20:59:32
Had a 300 mile round trip at the weekend......all went well.
lh2.4 seems to have learnt to new injectors.
Time to have some fun. :)
Gradually upped the boost......this is where this got complicated as I'm new to these fangled turbo things.
Got to point where I reached a peak of 16psi which dropped to 14/15psi then as revs rised continued to drop to 10/11psi.
Checked for leaks in the pipe work and inlet....all o.k
mmmm...more homework.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]CBV :[/COLOR]
A small diameter hose connects between the inlet manifold and the relief valve - changing pressure conditions (vacuum or pressure) will exceed the valves internal spring, and the valve will depending on type either open or close accordingly.
A CBV or BOV relief valve is forced firmly closed under pressure conditions (turbocharger producing boost ), until such time as a lower pressure condition occurs with throttle lift off or between gear changes. An instant lower pressure condition or vacuum inside the inlet manifold will then pull the valve open , momentarily venting boost pressure to atmosphere BOV, or recycled CBV.
Vacuum (pressure less than atmospheric) is formed in the cylinder bore/s when a piston decends (on intake stroke). vacuum transfers through the opening and closing inlet valves back into the inlet manifold , and rises when the throttle plate is fully closed.
Bosch style relief valves are compressor bypass valves , and are most of the time under engine vacuum (idle, cruise, throttle lift-off), but close firmly under positive (boost) pressure. This style returns (recycles) the air quietly back to the turbo compressor inlet or air cleaner area.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Wastegate actuator : [/COLOR]
Internal or external, a wastegate is a boost-controlling device that operates by limiting exhaust gases going through the turbocharger, controlling the maximum boost pressure produced by the turbocharger itself. A wastegate consists of an inlet and outlet port, a valve and a pressure actuator.
A pressure actuator, controlled by boost pressure determines whether the wastegate is open or shut. In its resting position, a wastegate is shut, and as the boost pressure builds, force is applied to the actuator. When the boost pressure exceeds the spring value, the actuator will progressively open the wastegate, bypassing some of the exhaust gases therefore maintaining the boost pressure at the set level. To put it simply – a wastegate prevents the boost pressure from climbing indefinitely and consequently blowing the engine.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Heath robinson strikes again : CBV[/COLOR]
Looked at uprated cbv's but can't stretch to a forge or similar. A dump valve wont work as letting already metered air out to atmosphere screwing up the ecu fueling constants.....so I purchased a new mitzi rebuild kit.....comes with a new thicker reinfored rubber diaphram. I'd also seen the ipd kit that shim the spring, this increases spring pre-load and holding capacity. Basically washers between metal case and spring.
Recommended usage : 9 - 10 psi 2 shims
11 - 13 psi 3 shims
14 - 16 psi 4 shims
17 - 20 psi 5 shims
So I added 2 washer into the cbv cover. Thought I'd play it safe.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Wastegate actuator :[/COLOR] : Again please don't hate....but wanted to find what was happening. With no mbc held constant 7psi but couldnt hold above an adjusted 10 psi.
So I removed the mbc and went on the hunt for a helper spring that connects to end of wastegate arm increasing base pressure.
Found a collection of various springs and measured basic spring rates. Brake shoe springs come very close to 10 lb.
once installed quick run showed very stable 11psi peak and constant 10psi.
Installed mbc and increased to indicated 15psi.....max peak 16/17 psi then held contant 15/14 psi throughout revs.
So now I need to get a new actuator.....looking at an adjustable kanugawa with prob 10/12 psi base then I can tranfer it to future turbo upgrade. Might possibly stretch to a -31 actuator.
Got to say even with the little 15g at 16psi its alot of fun :)
Post 724595 by Jamest5r on 2014-07-17 21:04:31
I only paid about 60 quid for a -34 from turbo technics, nice work btw :)
Post 724596 by oblark on 2014-07-17 21:06:16
The boost dropping off could be the TCV duty cycle and is part of the map.
Post 724597 by artfulflounder on 2014-07-17 21:20:21
[QUOTE=oblark;724596]The boost dropping off could be the TCV duty cycle and is part of the map.[/QUOTE]
Dont think the 940 had tcv system ??
Post 724598 by oblark on 2014-07-17 21:29:05
It was just a thought :)
Post 724599 by artfulflounder on 2014-07-17 21:34:10
[QUOTE=oblark;724598]It was just a thought :)[/QUOTE]
Its all helpful :)
All we get is basic knock sensor that alters ignition and fuel cut when maf is maxed.
Thats where 012 maf comes in and moves the maf linearity scale upwards allowing more flow.
No fuel cut so far at 16 psi :)
Deserately need wideband fitted before I push things too far. Should be in next couple of weeks when I go 3" exhaust.
Post 724603 by Kingsford G on 2014-07-17 21:56:01
[QUOTE=artfulflounder;718585]Tonights update......
YAY......new bpr7s fitted doubled checked everything and the old girl struck up straight away.
settled down quickly to a nice steady idle.
Only ran for a few minutes got to cure exhaust manifold paint.
dont seem to have any drips but will run for longer next time. I did have to slacken off waterpump and apply bit more upward pressure to seal to head but that seems fine.
God I am so relieved. ......I was dreading today, thought I'd maybe messed something up and have to strip it all down.
Bit long winded and its took 7 pages of this thread but I've now done my first ever head gasket change.lol
big thanks to everyone thats helped along the way, wouldn't have got this far without you :)
[/QUOTE]
Very nice mate,great work.
Now some before pics of the bowls.
Most of the work in the bowls will be smoothing out the waisted/stepped section in the bowls and the short side radius. The exhaust ports although can't be seen in the pics have the same shelf in the ports so i'm hoping that i can smooth the bowls and widen the arch to assist with flow.
Also going to be carrying on with the gasket matching.
I have actually carried out a good 12hrs work on the ports so far as it stands. Got good basic shape and did a little bit on each port before moving to the next to try and make them all potentially flow the same.
But i've not had time to put the pics up yet.
hopefully will have time to update again tomorrow.
Have done some more work smoothing the arch into the bowl and also gasket matched the runner.
Need to complete the bowl and runner to 180 grit.
So far so good? what do you guys think?
I've done alot more work on the transition from the arch to the bowl and runner. Widened the side and rounded them off alot more. So expect another few update pics.
The bowl floors have a lot of variants in with regards to depth and valve stem guide height so still got to clean that up.
These will also be polished alot more than the inlet side and try to make the runners as smooth as possible.
So these 2 last updates are a couple of days behind were i currently am but hopefully by the weekend i should be finished the bowl work.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Exhaust:[/COLOR]
Done alot more work on the exhaust side with regards to the port and the runner.
Widened the transition from arch to bowl quite a large amount and raised the short side radius. Polished the runners upto 320 grit so far, might leave it at this as not going to see massive improvements due to keeping standard valves.....I've probably done far more than i needed to for a daily driver but it seemed an ideal time to give it a try.
Still not finished yet, will post up further updates as i can.
cheers peeps.
I just thought that for what its worth i would just give the old girl a bit of a face lift. Nothing too extreme.
Anyway did my home work and found out all correct torques and order for tightening everything, and fitted the head back, along with intake manifold and throttle body. New thermostat and waterpump too.
All seemed to go surprisingly well.
still got to fit throttle cable, injector rail and most the electrics on that side so bound to be some hard to find bits yet.
Got a pile of parts for the exhaust side hanging in the shed having been treated to some paint so these will go on after the intake side is done.
Yeah doesn't seem so daunting now.....i did panic a while ago and thought i'd tried to do too much and i would never end up getting the old girl running again.
Hopefully now that won't be the case.
The exhaust manifold has been painted along with the turbine housing, which also had 2 studs removed from 850 fitment and drilled out for 940 studs.
Split the compressor from centre housing so just need to finish prepping for paint then i can re-assemble for rwd.
Install new radiator and intercooler, new piping for filter and make a heat shield. Change fluids and that should be pretty much it.
Once i know i'm all up and running it'll be a 3" exhaust and a session with tunerpro.
Ordered new cam belt covers but cut a hole in front for cam gear, if I upgrade to adjustable gear later on will allow for easy adjustment too.
Been modifying airbox so I can use it as a heat shield but with a cone filter.
Ordered an oil catch can but only basic ebay one, so got to fit some baffles inside when it turns up.
Got an oil catch tank ordered. Planning on adding an additional 15mm secondary breather hose to the standard pcv box and running both to a baffled catch can.
The plan is to also add second catch can for a baffled b20 oil filler cap to vent from valve cover.
Been eyeing up a new oil cooler too. Being auto has an oil cooler in radiator endcap plus a little 8 row oil cooler infront of intercooler.
Thinking about getting a larger 13 row jobbie. Anyone got an oil cooler kicking around that would be a good upgrade?
Need to do accumulator mod pretty sharpish too.
Plug leads are another must, but looking into those now too. Could probably go wasted spark for price of a set of magnecors.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]My way of doing things:[/COLOR]
Adding a catch can into the system allows extra removal of oil droplets from blowby and also has an effect of incresing the systems ability of coping with the extra volume of blowby.
Increasing hose size can also assist in improving flow of blowby from the breather, slowing the crank case vapour down also allowing better oil seperation.
I decided on a mixture of several options.
first off I added an extra 16mm or 5/8 hose tail to top section of the pcv breather box.
So I now have 2 16mm hoses from the pcv, increases volume of ventilation. These run to a 5/8 Y and into one of the catch can ports........nothing special just an ebay special.
All fine then? Well no cause its just an empty can....mmmm, no baffles or anything to help with seperation.....bugger.
Another quick search and found cheap way to add a basic baffleish contraption. Just needed some copper pipe and a filter.
moves incoming vapour away from outlet so just need some filter medium.
just used some stainless pan scourers. Wrapped round pipe to allow capturing of oil droplets.
Its a bit heath robinson but hopefully should work.
As this is my daily driver and do mainly start stop driving I connected the outlet back to the intake, including the 4mm take off to intake manifold with introduces vacuum at idle, should stop seals blowing.
I'll see how it goes.....I could vent catch can to atmosphere using a venturi effect from exhaust to introduce a vacuum but dont want to drip oil everywhere and dont necessarily feel the need to at this point.
Well thats that so far......may have done it all wrong but its all new to me so this is another learning experience.
Cheers for reading through the usual wall of drivel ;)
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Stage 1:[/COLOR]
Just painted several bits: airbox lid, intercooler hard pipes, slam panel, coil. I like the white clean and simple.
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Stage 2:[/COLOR]
This is m-r-p's fault but something was missing....mmmm, good idea fit some white vacuum lines.
The large clear reinforced lines are for the catch can....will change them in due time but will allow me to see how the crank case ventilation is working. Still needed to tidy up the hose routing and secure them but you get the idea.
The rocker cover well that is a surprise.....learnt loads and had to strip and repaint it 3 times to get what I wanted but hopefully some of you guys will like it ;)
Next updates coming soon :)
No good to man or beast so managed to find a proper 2 x single din from a 760
Started looking for a double din dvd player. Ended up getting side tracked and changed direction and have now started installing a 7" tablet in the double din space as a media player.
Doing my usual research and have already ordered some of the peripheral items and cables.
Heres a mock up with a tab of similar size to give you an idea.
So work is continuing and now I'm mobile will have to get out and meet some of you guys :)